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#21
03-13-2005, 03:28 AM
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Re: AJ on a rag board.
[ QUOTE ]
No read Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (9 handed) converter Preflop: Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 raises</font>, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, Hero calls. Flop: (4.33 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, Hero calls. Turn: (3.16 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, Hero folds. Final Pot: 4.16 BB [/ QUOTE ] I am tight as hell from the blinds, but I consider dumping this pf. If you're gonna play this hand, c/r the flop and lead any non K-Q turn. If you get 3-bet, toss it. This line may be hideous, but IMO it is the only way to go. 
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#22
03-13-2005, 03:30 AM
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Re: AJ on a rag board.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] of course hero would have to follow up with a turn bet [/ QUOTE ] I disagree. If we check the turn here, and don't improve on the river and the villan bets in to us, I think Hero can safely fold. The villan isn't likely to be on a bluff here. Betting the turn again is just costing us 1 extra bet to get to the river. [/ QUOTE ] Check/raising the flop is silly if we don't bet the turn. People will just about never fold to the actual check/raise. If we check the turn, the villian will almost surely bet it. By betting we at least have some folding equity that we don't have when we check/call. Brad [/ QUOTE ] Perfecto.
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#23
03-13-2005, 03:33 AM
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Re: AJ on a rag board.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I presume a typical opponent will never fold his pair of 9's unless a big over comes - like an A. [/ QUOTE ] Given that the villain open raised I think it's not as likely that he has a made hand. If he has AA-TT then so be it but he could also have a big combination of overcards or something like 88 or 77 that would be more likely to fold to a turn bet. Of course this is very dependant on the type of player and what hands he will open raise with. [/ QUOTE ] This is why, if you decide to see the flop, a c/r is perfect. If he has TT-AA, you will most likely be 3-bet on the flop, at which point you can ditch it. When you lead any non A-Q turn, you are making it very difficult for him to call you.
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#24
03-13-2005, 03:42 AM
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Re: AJ on a rag board.
[ QUOTE ]
This is why, if you decide to see the flop, a c/r is perfect. If he has TT-AA, you will most likely be 3-bet on the flop... [/ QUOTE ] Unless opponent (with position) is waiting until the turn with his overpair to pop you--in which case it will cost you two BB from the flop forward to learn that your whiffed overcards really are no good.
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#25
03-13-2005, 03:43 AM
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Re: AJ on a rag board.
i don't know...i think a checkraise can only be bluff...what hands are you ahead of? KQ maybe KJ suited...maybe A-10suited...
usually you are behind to a pair or AK-AQ. and if i'm the raiser and have a big pocket pair, i won't 3 bet your checkraise. I'm going to call and raise your big bet on the turn. So I think you're basically hoping he has a bigger ace and trying to bluff him off of it. I don't know if this is going to happen often enough to make it worth trying.
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#26
03-13-2005, 03:52 AM
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Re: AJ on a rag board.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] This is why, if you decide to see the flop, a c/r is perfect. If he has TT-AA, you will most likely be 3-bet on the flop... [/ QUOTE ] Unless opponent (with position) is waiting until the turn with his overpair to pop you--in which case it will cost you two BB from the flop forward to learn that your whiffed overcards really are no good. [/ QUOTE ] Indeed, but that's the risk you run. IMO this line will work more than 50% of the time at Party 2/4 and 3/6. We both know a 2+2'er will take your line, but I assume (and hope) that they make up significantly less than 50% of the Party population.
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#28
03-13-2005, 11:41 AM
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Re: AJ on a rag board.
I think a lot of advice in this thread is a tad overaggressive with betting and check-raising, etc.
If we assume raiser has a better hand (J-J, A-Q or better), you shouldn't even play it to begin with. It is very rare to push someone off a better hand with a rag board like this at a low limt game. People will call down with their A-Q and A-K all the time, even after a check-raise. Now if we suspect the raiser is raising light, that's a different story altogether, but we have no read here.
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#29
03-13-2005, 12:21 PM
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Re: AJ on a rag board.
[ QUOTE ]
Duh, I'm brain dead. I meant flop. [/ QUOTE ] Oh, and I thought you were old school like Brunson who calls the flop and the turn the turn. Those guys didn't need terminological niceties. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]
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#30
03-13-2005, 01:36 PM
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Re: AJ on a rag board.
[ QUOTE ]
I think a lot of advice in this thread is a tad overaggressive with betting and check-raising, etc. If we assume raiser has a better hand (J-J, A-Q or better), you shouldn't even play it to begin with. It is very rare to push someone off a better hand with a rag board like this at a low limt game. People will call down with their A-Q and A-K all the time, even after a check-raise. Now if we suspect the raiser is raising light, that's a different story altogether, but we have no read here. [/ QUOTE ] Opponent raised 4 off the button from middle position. I don't think it's reasonable to limit his hands to AQ or better. There are unpaired kings and suited broadway cards that will make this raise.
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