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#21
03-12-2005, 05:31 PM
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Re: Rake Free Sites
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] What power do we have, "Hey all the good players are gonna leave so all your weak players won't lose as much to use, play more and make you more in rake!" I don't think if the entire 2+2 community left Party we would even be a blip on their radar, at least a negative one. If the rake gets to high to make a profit, as in your example, then yes, I move on, but if Party, after rake, is still the place I can make the most $/Hr, then that is the place I play. Sure I want the rake reduced, but the chances of that are slim and I don't see us as having any power to affect it. [/ QUOTE ] It is possible for say a site to cap your monthly rake at 500 or even 1000 per month and return the rest of your rake to high volume players. I am sure some site might be nice enough to let me only pay 12,000 a year to play poker. Seems like a lot of money to me. I could get a vacation house for that. Things like that will only happen if the level of disatifaction rasies. Teach the fish that excsive rake sucks, I hate those users. [/ QUOTE ] I am not agruing that I like to pay rake, I just don't see us as having the power to change it so we have to evaluate based on our win rate. I would love for a site to offer a rake cap. I think if Party offered a rake cap each month most of us on rake back programs at other sites would switch back, but only after evaluating whether a rake cap at Party saved me more in total rake than rake back at another skin. That would depend largely on where they set the rake cap. A rake cap of $50 would mean even .5/1 players would come screaming back, but a cap of $2500 would mean my current rake back deal is better for the amount I play. Vern 
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#23
03-12-2005, 06:50 PM
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Re: Rake Free Sites
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] they simply start raking you after the monthly cap is reached [/ QUOTE ] That's even stupider. Meow. [/ QUOTE ] How so? The monthy cap is what they use to attract players. they use their low rake scheme which is implemented in this way, which imho is the best way to implment it.
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#24
03-12-2005, 06:53 PM
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Re: Rake Free Sites
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#25
03-12-2005, 07:01 PM
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Re: Rake Free Sites
[ QUOTE ]
Geez, what is the different between a rake free site and a normal rake site? At a rake site, you pay as you play. At a rake free site, you pay up front. A rake free site is not truly rake free if you pay that rake in advance. [/ QUOTE ] Thank you. I don't see why people have so much trouble understanding this. If you think the rake is too high, then you should want them to lower it. If you think the rake is too high, having them merely change the manner in which they collect it is pointless. If Party currently makes $1B/year in rake, do you think that if they switched to monthly fees they would do it such that they only collect $100M/year? Of course not. If you think that the price they charge for their service is too high, why does it seem like the best response is to ask them to charge it in a different fashion?
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#26
03-12-2005, 07:11 PM
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Re: Rake Free Sites
[ QUOTE ]
Dutch Boyd arrived in living rooms around the country during ESPN's 2003 World Series of Poker. His poker career began four years before that, at age eighteen, when he started adding tournament wins to the list of accomplishments that already included a law degree. As an insightful youth in St. Louis he played guitar, enjoyed movies, and read avidly, first honing his card skills in games with his mother and brother. After the 2003 WSOP, Dutch formed a crew of young poker players to attack the game collectively. Within one year they were competing with the world’s best, winning tournaments and traveling to high-stakes poker games throughout the United States. Dutch continues to play poker, advance the cause of “rakefree” cardrooms online, and has established a website of poker advice at ...... [/ QUOTE ] Also, if I'm not mistaken, Boyd is the same inidvidual who couldn't keep a poker room alive, when it was charging rake. So, logically, we can assume that when his room isn't charging rake, it will do quite well! [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]
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#27
03-12-2005, 07:17 PM
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Re: Rake Free Sites
Its not that they charge in a different fashion its that htey charge less.
Im not sure where this is hard to understand. The rake free sites cap their rake. They are offering you the service of poker for 30 dollars a month. That is the price, that is waht they charge. Party charges based on how much you play. For me that is 8000 dollars a month. 8k or 30 hmm, which part is difficult?
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#28
03-12-2005, 07:17 PM
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Re: Rake Free Sites
[ QUOTE ]
We are the players that creat the games, we 8 table, we make up a strong portion of the player base, they come with us, we determine the market. [/ QUOTE ] You are wrong about this. And in fact, I don't know WHY anyone would ever want to run a rake free site (that is, to be the owners of the site, not players), or one where the rake is capped ? The sharks are your worst players - they take money from the poker sites other players and put in their own pocket. If instead everybody was a relatively equal fish they would push their money around until everybody was a loser and Party would make even more ! Honestly, If I had a site I would have some sort of scheme where the rake is really high but you get some large % of it back as a "Bonus" free and clear if you buy back in after busting out- that way you charge the sharks the max but help keep the fish.
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#29
03-12-2005, 07:26 PM
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Re: Rake Free Sites
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] We are the players that creat the games, we 8 table, we make up a strong portion of the player base, they come with us, we determine the market. [/ QUOTE ] You are wrong about this. And in fact, I don't know WHY anyone would ever want to run a rake free site (that is, to be the owners of the site, not players), or one where the rake is capped ? The sharks are your worst players - they take money from the poker sites other players and put in their own pocket. If instead everybody was a relatively equal fish they would push their money around until everybody was a loser and Party would make even more ! Honestly, If I had a site I would have some sort of scheme where the rake is really high but you get some large % of it back as a "Bonus" free and clear if you buy back in after busting out- that way you charge the sharks the max but help keep the fish. [/ QUOTE ] Your logic here is faulty. So you wouldnt like to run a rake free site and make 1 million a year, if the players wanted rake free, all you ahve to do is start it up and collect money. Check out this htread http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...=1#Post1913381 we as winning players are not parasites to the poker world. Many BandM casinos higher props, which are winning players, to play in theri games. Because if a game is going, the casino is making money. Party is making tons o f money because we 8 table and fill up the games.
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#30
03-12-2005, 07:49 PM
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Re: Rake Free Sites
Ok then, what happens in this situation...
A group of friends and I play a lot of poker. Instead of each of us opening up an account at a rake free site and paying $30/month, we all just share a single account only paying the fee once. If you think there aren't players out there who currently share accounts, you would be mistaken. And what about players who play sparingly? What you are basically doing is punishing them for NOT playing enough. That sure doesn't sound like a fair business model. Bottom line, as is apparent to anyone with a brain, the BEST and ONLY solutions are to lower the overall rake or give every player rakeback without having to jump through the hoops of an affiliate. Meow.
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