WSOP Day 4: "Official" News, Results, and Discussion [Archive] - Page 2

BlackAces

07-12-2005, 07:08 PM

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Pretty good tournament from Full Tilt's perspective (and Pokerstars obviously)

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Didn't full tilt give away 10% of their pro's in the WSOP through a few weekly tourneys??? I bet a few people are on edge right now because they stand to make a ton of money off them.

Cool idea and I bet it works wonders for site promotion.

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Yeah, if Ivey or Juanda wins, someone's getting $750K dumped into their account. Not bad.

I don't think they were giving away a piece of Matusow, but I could be mistaken.

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 07:13 PM

The following players won $39,075:
177 Dutch Boyd
176 Jan Haellen
175 Jason Kaplan
174 Joseph Vannata
173 Randall Brooks
172 Dennis Savelkawl
171 Matthew Fizgerald
The following players won $46,245:
170 Anthony Hill
169 Glyn Banks
168 John McLaughlin
167 Jeffrey Geiger
166 Kevin O'Brien
165 Mark tenner
164 Imad Samouna
163 David Sterman
162 Brick Richardson
161 Kjetil Praesttun
160 Paul Darden
159 James Pollack
158 Edward Pelliger
157 Thomas CLark
156 Daryll Dennfas
155 Mitchek Klien
154 Clifford Cantor
153 ????
152 Michael May
151 Thomas Koral
150 Joe Beevers
149 Frank Hernandez
148 Paul Manetta
147 David Platik
146 Yamtov Shabot
145 Mark Bryab
144 Babak Razu
143 Michael Kapener
142 Robert Law
141 Mark Graves

All from Dr. Pauly

Kevin...

cwsiggy

07-12-2005, 07:14 PM

Dammit! I go to dinner and see the man was eliminated.

Mano

07-12-2005, 07:15 PM

From Gutshot:

4:09pm

Greg Raymer $1,700,000
Tiffany Williamson $950,000
Andrew Black $320,000
Mike Matusow $900,000

Klepton

07-12-2005, 07:16 PM

this girl looks like a huge bitch

tiffany williamson (or "call the clock" girl):

http://www.gutshot.com/wsop/wsop2005dev/LIVE/tiffDay4.jpg

LearnedfromTV

07-12-2005, 07:16 PM

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It was a mistake because he allowed Greg to not make a mistake by calling. Greg would have called that bet even if the guy flipped his KK up on the table. He violated the Fundamental Theorem of Poker -- anytime your opponent plays the same as he would if he could see your cards, he gains and you lose.

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Well, is that true? Greg is ahead on the flop like what, 1/6 of the time? And the remaining 5/6, the guy picks up the pot including an extra 50k.

Also, talking about it as a face-up situation ignores the fact that Greg will sometimes call the flop bet when he's behind. I think the only way it becomes a mathematical mistake is if the guy plans on pushing the flop even if an ace comes.

[/ QUOTE ]

This size raise is terrible with KK BECAUSE he can't push an ace-high flop. Assuming he pushes a non-ace flop and check-folds an ace-high flop, he's giving Raymer 5-1 to flop an ace, at which point he gives up the pot. The pot odds are there already, just to flop an ace. And KK, OOP, can't push an ace high flop and possibly push Raymer off his weak kicker, because he doesn't know he has a weak ace.

Add to that the 12-1 implied odds he's giving him to flop a monster on a non-ace flop and it's a no-brainer. AT didn't make a mistake to call here. Raise 100-125K and it did. The smaller raise is better, but still bad, I think, if he has AA, because he doesn't have to worry about an ace flopping nearly 20% of the time. KK is vulnerable, especiallyOOP, especially against a big stack, especially against someone who can read a hand.

Not sure if my point is as clear as I'd like it to be: Position is the key because of how the hand will play when an ace flops (with no K). He never wins, even though Raymer happens to have a weak ace, because he has to show his fear of the A before Raymer acts. I think if he pushes the flop, Raymer folds with one pair, whether A or T, but KK can't know that, so he can't push an ace-high flop.

Edited to add that the reason I think Raymer folds to a push on an ace high flop is that he, with a big stack and position, KNOWS the guy can't push into him without having him beat.

Mano

07-12-2005, 07:23 PM

The following approximate chip counts are of notable players and do not include the entire field. Final chip counts will be posted the following morning under "Event Results".
Date / Time: 2005-07-12 16:14:00

Player Amount Table Seat
Greg Raymer $1,550,000 0 0
Rod Pardey $1,200,000 0 0
James Butt $1,160,000 0 0
Farzad Bonyadi $1,000,000 0 0
Minh Ly $950,000 0 0
John Juanda $950,000 0 0
Russell Hamilton $910,000 0 0
Tim Phan $890,000 0 0
Mike Matusow $864,000 0 0
Brad Kondracki $830,000 0 0
Webber Kang $800,000 0 0
Hung La $780,000 0 0
Shawn Sheikhan $740,000 0 0
Tiffany Williamson $710,000 0 0
Oskar Silow $680,000 0 0
Marcella Del Grosso $650,000 0 0
Bing Wang $606,000 0 0
Gabe Walls $560,000 0 0
Ralph Perry $550,000 0 0
Phil Ivey $500,000 0 0
Gregory Rice $478,000 0 0
Jason Lester $475,000 0 0
Kenna James $470,000 0 0
Jarl Jordenson $460,000 0 0
Terry Myers $420,000 0 0
Dustin Woolf $376,000 0 0
Tom Pniak $350,000 0 0
Nick Cassavettes $340,000 0 0
Josh Prager $330,000 0 0
Louie Calvo $330,000 0 0
Andrew Black $322,000 0 0
Manelic Minaya $290,000 0 0
Rob Turner $280,000 0 0
Joe Toth $250,000 0 0
Lee Watkinson $230,000 0 0
Scott Lazar $230,000 0 0
Mike Wattel $215,000 0 0
Sean Doulat $210,000 0 0
JC Tran $200,000 0 0
CK Hua $200,000 0 0
Tom Sartori $140,000 0 0
Peter Hedlund $120,000 0 0
Russell Salzer $70,000 0 0

shant

07-12-2005, 07:25 PM

Family Guy

A guy from the crowd was asking Raymer's wife about his daughter... Mrs Raymer informed the Fossilman who got a tad irrate and threatened to kill the man if he went near his family! It took a good few minutes for him to compose himself and get back to the game. (allegedly)

ericsind

07-12-2005, 07:26 PM

raymer must be pushing the table around with his big stack. he increased 400 or 500K over the last few hours without any big hand updates...

Mr_Oog

07-12-2005, 07:26 PM

Not necessarily defending the play, but possibly he had already decided to push any flop? Basically like a stop and go. (We'll call it the mini go and go.) Ideally he would never even look at the flop to make sure there was no reaction.
-Mike

BlackRain

07-12-2005, 07:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Family Guy

A guy from the crowd was asking Raymer's wife about his daughter... Mrs Raymer informed the Fossilman who got a tad irrate and threatened to kill the man if he went near his family! It took a good few minutes for him to compose himself and get back to the game. (allegedly)

[/ QUOTE ]

Joke? Source? Bizarre post...

fnurt

07-12-2005, 07:29 PM

Well, he gets 5-1 odds to flop an ace, but the odds of flopping an ace are right around 5-1, so that's about an even-money proposition right there.

Beyond that, you are right that Greg sometimes gets a monster flop without an ace (TT or KQJ) but you forgot the much larger chance that Greg will sometimes call when he's behind, such as a T-high flop. The implied odds go in both directions.

Finally, if Greg is going to call 50k here just in hopes of flopping an ace, he had better be awfully certain that AK is not in his opponent's range of hands.

touchfaith

07-12-2005, 07:30 PM

Homer

07-12-2005, 07:30 PM

shant

07-12-2005, 07:31 PM

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 07:32 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Family Guy

A guy from the crowd was asking Raymer's wife about his daughter... Mrs Raymer informed the Fossilman who got a tad irrate and threatened to kill the man if he went near his family! It took a good few minutes for him to compose himself and get back to the game. (allegedly)

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Joke? Source? Bizarre post...

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From pokervoice.com:

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His wife, in the press area watching him, is asked by a a spectator about his family. Greg, according to the spectator, gets the wrong end of the stick and tells the the spectator 'You f*** with my daughter and you're dead'.

Very out of character for Greg but he's playing for a huge amount of money and is hounded by fans and media at every break, we can't blame him for being a little grumpy and protective of his family.

Greg is chip leader with around 1.5 million.

Thankfully the dealer did not call the floor and inflame the situation and there was no 10 minute penalty.

[/ QUOTE ]

Kevin...

TAR

07-12-2005, 07:32 PM

This is what Pauly at Tao of Poker wrote:

4:17pm... Fossilman jawed with a railbird who was pestering his wife about their kids, "If you [censored] with my daughter, you're dead." That guy was being a total idiot and I was about to call security to clear him out when the guy bolted.

Sponger15SB

07-12-2005, 07:34 PM

[ QUOTE ]
This is what Pauly at Tao of Poker wrote:

4:17pm... Fossilman jawed with a railbird who was pestering his wife about their kids, "If you [censored] with my daughter, you're dead." That guy was being a total idiot and I was about to call security to clear him out when the guy bolted.

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WTF is he thinking? Yeah good idea, threaten to kill someone in front of hundreds of people while you're playing for $7.5mil

Paxosmotic

07-12-2005, 07:36 PM

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This is what Pauly at Tao of Poker wrote:

4:17pm... Fossilman jawed with a railbird who was pestering his wife about their kids, "If you [censored] with my daughter, you're dead." That guy was being a total idiot and I was about to call security to clear him out when the guy bolted.

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WTF is he thinking? Yeah good idea, threaten to kill someone in front of hundreds of people while you're playing for $7.5mil

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Yeah really, for 7.5mil you can just hire someone to do it for you. Think Greg, think.

LearnedfromTV

07-12-2005, 07:38 PM

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Not necessarily defending the play, but possibly he had already decided to push any flop? Basically like a stop and go. (We'll call it the mini go and go.) Ideally he would never even look at the flop to make sure there was no reaction.
-Mike

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I guess, but the only hand he could be wanting to push Raymer off is a flopped ace and if he's going to try that he might as well look at the damn flop.... and we're back where we started. Stop and go is to prevent a guy from seeing the last two cards; if no ace flops, he's doing that anyway.

-Skeme-

07-12-2005, 07:39 PM

Damn, that's crazy. Fossilman is the real deal. That's like, a good title for his book.

"Fossilman's Tournament Strategy Book: [censored] with his daughter and you're dead."

I can see a whole market for this.

shant

07-12-2005, 07:44 PM

JC Tran Eliminated
Log:

With the board showing 9-7-6, JC Tran and Oskar Silow are all-in. Tran holds 5-5, while Silow has Q-Q. The turn are river are a 3 and 9, respectively, and Tran is eliminated by Silow.

PITTM

07-12-2005, 07:44 PM

[ QUOTE ]
This is what Pauly at Tao of Poker wrote:

4:17pm... Fossilman jawed with a railbird who was pestering his wife about their kids, "If you [censored] with my daughter, you're dead." That guy was being a total idiot and I was about to call security to clear him out when the guy bolted.

[/ QUOTE ]

there has to be a bit more to it. anyone see the whole thing unfold?

rj

zuluking

07-12-2005, 07:44 PM

[ QUOTE ]
4:17pm... Fossilman jawed with a railbird who was pestering his wife about their kids, "If you [censored] with my daughter, you're dead." That guy was being a total idiot and I was about to call security to clear him out when the guy bolted.

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Did Shooter McGavin hire him?

Freudian

07-12-2005, 07:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
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This is what Pauly at Tao of Poker wrote:

4:17pm... Fossilman jawed with a railbird who was pestering his wife about their kids, "If you [censored] with my daughter, you're dead." That guy was being a total idiot and I was about to call security to clear him out when the guy bolted.

[/ QUOTE ]

there has to be a bit more to it. anyone see the whole thing unfold?

rj

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Obviously the guy had to be pretty creepy to result in a comment like that.

Mr_Gordon

07-12-2005, 07:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
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4:17pm... Fossilman jawed with a railbird who was pestering his wife about their kids, "If you [censored] with my daughter, you're dead." That guy was being a total idiot and I was about to call security to clear him out when the guy bolted.

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Did Shooter McGavin hire him?

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Jackass!

LearnedfromTV

07-12-2005, 07:49 PM

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Well, he gets 5-1 odds to flop an ace, but the odds of flopping an ace are right around 5-1, so that's about an even-money proposition right there.

Beyond that, you are right that Greg sometimes gets a monster flop without an ace (TT or KQJ) but you forgot the much larger chance that Greg will sometimes call when he's behind, such as a T-high flop. The implied odds go in both directions.

Finally, if Greg is going to call 50k here just in hopes of flopping an ace, he had better be awfully certain that AK is not in his opponent's range of hands.

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We're not talking about Greg's decision to call, we're talking about the size of KK's reraise. There's a distinction there. He's the one who knows he has KK and hates an ace. He also doesn't know what Raymer has and is out of position.

I happen think calling with AT there is a bad play for most players, even with those odds, for the reason you state, but I'll give the champ the benefit of the doubt that he can use his position and read to make it profitable. The point I'm making is about the spot KK gets himself in. Raymer could have anything as far as he's concerned. AT is actually about the worst hand for implied odds he could possibly have in this spot and it is still a marginal calling hand.

Think of it this way - vs. Raymer's range, KK has no business giving 12-1 implied odds on the aceless flophe certainly will push. Not to mention that he almost always gives up on an ace-high flop whether Greg has an ace or not.

roy_miami

07-12-2005, 07:53 PM

fnurt

07-12-2005, 07:54 PM

Well, give me some hands. AT may be a bad hand for implied odds, because you mostly have to flop an ace to win, but it seems like an excellent hand to have against KK overall.

I don't think the odds are 12-1, I think they're more like 8-1, aren't they? How many hands without an ace are really 8-1 to be ahead of KK on the flop?

BlackRain

07-12-2005, 07:55 PM

I think there must be more to the story than this. He must have had a gun, a partner, and planning to rob Greg in his hotel room after he wins the ME.

PITTM

07-12-2005, 07:56 PM

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I think there must be more to the story than this. He must have had a gun, a partner, and planning to rob Greg in his hotel room after he wins the ME.

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man, nothing like poorly timed, distasteful jokes...

rj

fnurt

07-12-2005, 07:56 PM

And to be clear, I was talking about Greg's decision to call because someone said it was correct under FTOP, which didn't seem clear to me.

Sponger15SB

07-12-2005, 07:56 PM

72off

07-12-2005, 08:00 PM

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I think its just Greg's attempt to reinvent his image.

He wants to be known as the "Ron Artest" of poker.

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Fossilman is ghetto!

Mano

07-12-2005, 08:04 PM

Tim Phan Busts One - Is New Chip Leader
Log: With the flop showing 9-8-4 Phan bets out, and is reraised all-in for $300,000 by Nani Dollison. Phan immediately calls. Dollison shows A-9, Phan shows 4-4. The turn card is a 9, increasing the number of cards that could counterfeit Phan's hand. The river is the 5s - no help for Dollison. She is eliminated, and Tim Phan is now chip leader with $1,750,000 in chips.

scott8

07-12-2005, 08:05 PM

3 of the top 4 chip leaders at one table.

TaoTe

07-12-2005, 08:12 PM

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3 of the top 4 chip leaders at one table.

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It's going to be a bloodbath.

BlackAces

07-12-2005, 08:14 PM

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And to be clear, I was talking about Greg's decision to call because someone said it was correct under FTOP, which didn't seem clear to me.

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Not quite what I said -- I said the raise was incorrect under FTOP, because it made Greg correctly call.

LearnedfromTV

07-12-2005, 08:15 PM

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Well, give me some hands. AT may be a bad hand for implied odds, because you mostly have to flop an ace to win, but it seems like an excellent hand to have against KK overall.

I don't think the odds are 12-1, I think they're more like 8-1, aren't they? How many hands without an ace are really 8-1 to be ahead of KK on the flop?

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I think you are right to say 8-1. It's 12-1 assuming Greg is 100% toi win when he calls, which of course is wrong. He's calling 50K to see a flop for a shot at a 600K pot, but his equity after the push is never the full 600. (edited to say I'm an idiot - the 200 he calls with can't be counted for him... so somewhere south of 8-1, like 6 or 7 to 1)

That said, any pair is a good place to start. Even discounting a bit for the chance of set over set and the chance of catching a K on the turn or river, letting Raymer see the flop with a pp for only 50K more is a mistake. I gotta think the medium suited connectors too. Is there a tool that can calculate this somewhere... i.e. what % of flops is XX ahead of YY? Even if I'm wrong strictly based on hand values, the fact that he's OOP with a smaller stack has to factor in too, specifically the fact that he knows he has to fear the ace. If Raymer has no ace and an ace hits, some percentage of the time KK gets pushed off the best hand. Plus every time Raymer has an ace and an ace hits, he takes the pot down. Raymer with AT know thatuntil he sees the flop action, but KK knows it.

Re your FTOP post, that makes sense. I guess I'm saying you can't evaluate a play based on the FTOP because there's incomplete information.

KK wins equity if he makes AT make a mistake compared with if they had complete information.

KK makes the right play, a different thing, when he makes the play most likely to cause his opponents range of hands to make a mistake . (Which is, of course, why I say AT is a worse hand for implied odds, than say 88, even though vs KK specifically that isn't the case)

PuckNPoker

07-12-2005, 08:15 PM

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3 of the top 4 chip leaders at one table.

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The TD can just keep setting small stacks on that table and let the big stacks grind em out so they can finish early tonight.

J.Brown

07-12-2005, 08:18 PM

any news, he is in, and had 1.2 million earlier, but no updates or listings have been posted about him.

any news would be great. cheers. J.Brown

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 08:18 PM

James Butt (one of the 3 chip leaders at the table) got moved there after JC Tran busted out. Raymer/Bonyadi are the other two.

Kevin...

ziggy_m

07-12-2005, 08:21 PM

Mike Matusow breaks 1.2 mil
Mike Matusow increased his chip stack to 1.26 million when he busted a player on the feature table with a pair of [A]'s made on the flop. The other player showed pocket [7]'s with no help on the board.

fnurt

07-12-2005, 08:23 PM

You're right that it becomes close. I tend to think of 10-1 as the odds you want for set value, but 8-1 is certainly in the ballpark. I've completely lost track of the bets and stack sizes at this point, but I think the thing about the 600k is that a big chunk of that is Greg's own money that's still in his stack.

If you told me 60k or 70k or whatever was the perfect bet I wouldn't disagree with you, although if it gets much higher than that you don't have enough for the flop. As usual, the way this all got started was some people who decided the 50k raise was just an obviously wrong play, and the guy clearly should have pushed, which just doesn't make sense to me.

You can always count on this at 2+2: when someone busts, the results players will always say "you shoulda raised more preflop!" Apparently there are some people who accumulate enough chips to win tournaments without ever letting their opponent see a flop.

Homer

07-12-2005, 08:24 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This is what Pauly at Tao of Poker wrote:

4:17pm... Fossilman jawed with a railbird who was pestering his wife about their kids, "If you [censored] with my daughter, you're dead." That guy was being a total idiot and I was about to call security to clear him out when the guy bolted.

[/ QUOTE ]

WTF is he thinking? Yeah good idea, threaten to kill someone in front of hundreds of people while you're playing for $7.5mil

[/ QUOTE ]

I would have done the same. Who cares about the 7.5 million when some psycho is [censored] with your wife?

TaoTe

07-12-2005, 08:28 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
... I hope the ESPN coverage is expansive enough to capture the tenor of his play, rather then the usual heavy editing that only shows "key" hands/big pots.

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Everyone is entitled to a dream....

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i actually laughed out loud at this. glad i wasn't drinking milk.

/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't even know what that post is supposed to mean, but I know nothing.

fnurt

07-12-2005, 08:28 PM

Seriously. If some guy starts spewing inappropriate [censored] about my daughter, I'm not going to just sit there and take it. Greg has to know the whole room has his back in that situation.

memphis57

07-12-2005, 08:30 PM

Could Greg be getting a bit distracted? Beisdes threatening kill some guy....

[ QUOTE ]

Greg Raymer's wife has brought him some new shirts, and he's taking the opportunity between hands to try them on.

[/ QUOTE ]

And now he's lost the chip lead, I hear.

Quake1028

07-12-2005, 08:31 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Could Greg be getting a bit distracted? Beisdes threatening kill some guy....

[ QUOTE ]

Greg Raymer's wife has brought him some new shirts, and he's taking the opportunity between hands to try them on.

[/ QUOTE ]

And now he's lost the chip lead, I hear.

[/ QUOTE ]

He didn't "lose" the chip lead by any bad play of his own, someone else won a huge pot.

chopstick

07-12-2005, 08:33 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Card Player Update Log
Date / Time: 2005-07-12 13:53:00
Title: Wang goes all-in on Butt
Log: With the flop showing Ks-8s-8c-7h-Qc, James Butt leads out for $50,000. Bing Wang comes over the top of Butt, going all-in. Both players show Q-8 and Butt and Wang chop, showing the nuts.

[/ QUOTE ]

1. not the nuts
2. funny as hell

[/ QUOTE ]

Date / Time: 2005-07-12 13:55:00
Title: Short Stack Power
Log: Short short short stack Mike Wattel ($32,000) raises all-in, and gets no callers, picking up the blinds and antes.

Date / Time: 2005-07-12 13:45:00
Title: Featured Table Update
Log: Mike Matusow is still at ESPN's Featured Table, but unfortunately he's not sharing a table with Greg Raymer like he was last night. It's also unfortunate that the media can't hear what he's saying. (The players are mic'd, but the audio goes directly to ESPN.) Here are the chip counts and seating positions:

Seat 1: Mike Matusow - $449,500
Seat 2: Joseph Chiosie - $248,500
Seat 3: Dustin "Neverwin" Woolf - $351,000
Seat 4: Joe Beevers - $124,500
Seat 5: Stephen Deetz - $142,500
Seat 6: Andrew Black - $251,000
Seat 7: Daniel Alaei - $116,000
Seat 8: Kjetil Praesttun - $114,500
Seat 9: Gregory Rice - $326,500

---

something is rotten in Denmark

ziggy_m

07-12-2005, 08:33 PM

Raymer Cannot Be Stopped
Log:

Gen Wattanabe goes all-in for his last . Greg mentions that he knows he's behind, but decides to call. Wattanabe shows J-J with one spade. Raymer turns over 8-6 - no spades. The flop comes 7s-3s-2s. Raymer has no pair, and no solid draw, while Wattanabe still has an overpair and a flush draw. The turn is a non-spade 5, giving Raymer an open ended straight draw, but he's still behind. The river brings a non-spade 9. Raymer hits his runner-runner straight, busts Wattanabe, and is now sitting atop a stack of $1,600,000.

newfant

07-12-2005, 08:34 PM

Ivey with almost 1 million in chips. This thing is over if Ivey gets the chip lead.

LetYouDown

07-12-2005, 08:34 PM

That's so 1.4 of Raymer.

sam h

07-12-2005, 08:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Ivey with almost 1 million in chips. This thing is over if Ivey gets the chip lead.

[/ QUOTE ]

No its not. With this many players left, many of whom are very talented, and the luck involved in tournament poker, everybody is still a long shot.

bholdr

07-12-2005, 08:38 PM

If ivey, raymer, and matasow somehow all make it to the final table, this'll be one for the ages. I can't believe how exciting it is to track this tournament- i was never really a fan of big NL tourneys until this. I am glued to cardplayer.com.

go fossilman.

Nottom

07-12-2005, 08:40 PM

Kevroc

07-12-2005, 08:41 PM

Daniel Shak is a trader on the NYMEX floor in NY, I work on that floor. When I see him, I will ask him exactly how the hand went down.

There has been alot of discussion about this hand, I will start a thread when I get the details.

(I hope it wasn't a 20k/25k/50k like the quote stated)

Platypus

07-12-2005, 08:41 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Raymer Cannot Be Stopped
Log:

Gen Wattanabe goes all-in for his last . Greg mentions that he knows he's behind, but decides to call. Wattanabe shows J-J with one spade. Raymer turns over 8-6 - no spades. The flop comes 7s-3s-2s. Raymer has no pair, and no solid draw, while Wattanabe still has an overpair and a flush draw. The turn is a non-spade 5, giving Raymer an open ended straight draw, but he's still behind. The river brings a non-spade 9. Raymer hits his runner-runner straight, busts Wattanabe, and is now sitting atop a stack of $1,600,000.

[/ QUOTE ]

Greg Raymer is a creature from outer-space.

cwsiggy

07-12-2005, 08:41 PM

rigged!!

LearnedfromTV

07-12-2005, 08:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
You're right that it becomes close. I tend to think of 10-1 as the odds you want for set value, but 8-1 is certainly in the ballpark. I've completely lost track of the bets and stack sizes at this point, but I think the thing about the 600k is that a big chunk of that is Greg's own money that's still in his stack.

If you told me 60k or 70k or whatever was the perfect bet I wouldn't disagree with you, although if it gets much higher than that you don't have enough for the flop. As usual, the way this all got started was some people who decided the 50k raise was just an obviously wrong play, and the guy clearly should have pushed, which just doesn't make sense to me.

You can always count on this at 2+2: when someone busts, the results players will always say "you shoulda raised more preflop!" Apparently there are some people who accumulate enough chips to win tournaments without ever letting their opponent see a flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah I caught the bit about it being his own money and fixed that post.

I think the key is that its KK OOP vs. an aggressive big stack which means even if he doesn't have an ace, he might as well. Couple that with the implied odds for the non-ace hands he might have and KK needs to make this something like 100K, not 50K. As far as KK is concerned, if Greg has 88, he basically has 6 cards to hit on the flop, since the Ace becomes his as soon as KK checks to him on an ace high flop.

I think the optimal raise with AA is significantly smaller than the optimal raise with KK.

As for leaving enough for the flop, it's real hard with his stack to give him a chance to make two big mistakes, and it is much easier to make him make a mistake before the flop than after, because of position. So I'd prefer overraising preflop and giving himn decent calling odds on a flush draw only, lets say, to putting myself in a position to make a big flop bet after giving my opponent a chance to hit the flop and then decide.

sam h

07-12-2005, 08:42 PM

Gutshot just put him at 1,450,000.

memphis57

07-12-2005, 08:44 PM

[ QUOTE ]

He didn't "lose" the chip lead by any bad play of his own, someone else won a huge pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I know, I was just spouting. I'm rooting for Raymer (well, Ivey then Raymer, actually). I just thought it was funny he's trying on shirts, threatening bystanders and, by the way, RETAKING THE LEAD!!

fnurt

07-12-2005, 08:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Ivey with almost 1 million in chips. This thing is over if Ivey gets the chip lead.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wasn't it over yesterday if Flack got a big stack? Yeah, yeah, I know, Ivey is unstoppable if he gets 1/50 of the chips in play, but still.

Mano

07-12-2005, 08:47 PM

The following approximate chip counts are of notable players and do not include the entire field. Final chip counts will be posted the following morning under "Event Results".
Date / Time: 2005-07-12 17:43:00

Player Amount Table Seat
Tim Phan $1,690,000 0 0
Greg Raymer $1,530,000 0 0
Mike Matusow $1,450,000 0 0
Tex Barch $1,400,000 0 0
John Juanda $1,200,000 0 0
Johnny Howard $1,100,000 0 0
Farzad Bonyadi $1,070,000 0 0
Oskar Silow $960,000 0 0
Terry Myers $920,000 0 0
Minh Ly $850,000 0 0
Steve Marx $850,000 0 0
Nick Gibson $840,000 0 0
Phil Ivey $800,000 0 0
James Butt $800,000 0 0
Hung La $800,000 0 0
Brad Kondracki $780,000 0 0
Rod Pardey $760,000 0 0
Andrew Black $740,000 0 0
Shane Bartholomew $730,000 0 0
Rady Butan $700,000 0 0
Russell Hamilton $700,000 0 0
Kenna James $700,000 0 0
Hon Lee $700,000 0 0
Shawn Sheikhan $690,000 0 0
Russell Salzer $660,000 0 0
Patrick Hayden $620,000 0 0
Will O Brien $600,000 0 0
John McGrane $600,000 0 0
Marcella Del Grosso $600,000 0 0
Karlo Lopez $600,000 0 0
Webber Kang $540,000 0 0
Jarl Jorgensen $500,000 0 0
Ayan Alsancak $480,000 0 0
Sean Doulat $470,000 0 0
Gabe Walls $450,000 0 0
Lee Watkinson $400,000 0 0
Ralph Perry $400,000 0 0
Sarah Bilney $370,000 0 0
Tom Pniak $360,000 0 0
Nick Cassavettes $360,000 0 0
Manelic Minaya $360,000 0 0
Terry Myers $300,000 0 0
Jason Lester $300,000 0 0
Scott Lazar $300,000 0 0
Jason Prager $250,000 0 0
CK Hua $220,000 0 0
Joe Chiesie $190,000 0 0
Rob Turner $170,000 0 0
Mike Wattel $160,000 0 0
Yahov Hirsch $160,000 0 0
Dustin Woolf $130,000 0 0
Peter Hedlund $130,000 0 0
Louis Calvo $115,000 0 0

yimyammer

07-12-2005, 08:48 PM

Courtesy of Gutshot......

A guy from the crowd was asking Raymer's wife about his daughter... Mrs Raymer informed the Fossilman who got a tad irrate and threatened to kill the man if he went near his family! It took a good few minutes for him to compose himself and get back to the game. (allegedly)

What the hell? Thats a rather provocative statement that deserves further explaination.

Anyone know the full story?

Platypus

07-12-2005, 08:50 PM

With the board showing J-5-5-A-5, Bonyadi bets out $80,000. Raymer raises to $230,000. Bonyadi then reraises $400,000 more, and Raymer finally folds. Bonyadi shows the King high bluff.

Mano

07-12-2005, 08:50 PM

Date / Time: 2005-07-12 17:44:00
Title: Raymer Gets Bluffed
Log: With the board showing J-5-5-A-5, Bonyadi bets out $80,000. Raymer raises to $230,000. Bonyadi then reraises $400,000 more, and Raymer finally folds. Bonyadi shows the King high bluff.

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 08:50 PM

Table 119: The Monster Stacks
[ QUOTE ]
Greg Raymer is sitting at Table 119, and he is sitting with some other heavy stacks. There are five players with over a million in chips right now: Greg Raymer, Oskar Silow, Farzad Bonyadi, Tex Barch, and James Butt. Raymer is the chip leader at the table, but he won't be able to bully the table very easily with so many other big stacks around.

[/ QUOTE ]

Kevin...

Kevroc

07-12-2005, 08:51 PM

How do they know it was a bluff?

Maybe he was value betting his King kicker?

DontRaisePlz

07-12-2005, 08:51 PM

Hon Lee with 700k? He wasnt on any chip counts earlier. Is this the same "kamikaze kid" from the season 1 WPT?

Nottom

07-12-2005, 08:51 PM

Dustin Woolf $130,000 0 0

Damn, what happened there?

Platypus

07-12-2005, 08:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
How do they know it was a bluff?

Maybe he was value betting his King kicker?

[/ QUOTE ]

good point.

Uglyowl

07-12-2005, 08:53 PM

Sponger15SB

07-12-2005, 08:54 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Dustin Woolf $130,000 0 0

Damn, what happened there?

[/ QUOTE ]

Reality set in.

Derek in NYC

07-12-2005, 08:57 PM

Isnt this the guy Microbob took out for his WSOP satelite?

2+2 wannabe

07-12-2005, 08:57 PM

Aceshigh7

07-12-2005, 08:57 PM

Damn, Juanda is on a tear. Hope to see him at the final table.

NLfool

07-12-2005, 08:58 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
With the board showing J-5-5-A-5, Bonyadi bets out $80,000. Raymer raises to $230,000. Bonyadi then reraises $400,000 more, and Raymer finally folds. Bonyadi shows the King high bluff.

[/ QUOTE ]

Raymer is human?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm rooting for Raymer but I can't see him raising here unles he himself is on a bluff on this type of board. K high was probably best

LearnedfromTV

07-12-2005, 08:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
How do they know it was a bluff?

Maybe he was value betting his King kicker?

[/ QUOTE ]

Bluffing with the best hand I think. Wouldn't Raymer call the flop with a J or pocket pair and call the reraise with an A? Gutsy play tho.

Mano

07-12-2005, 09:01 PM

Date / Time: 2005-07-12 17:55:00
Title: Bonyadi Crushes
Log: With the board showing A-7-7-2-4 Farzad Bonyadi bets out $100,000. James Butt answers back by raisingin to $400,000. Bonyadi thinks for a while and calls. Bonyadi shows A-9 for a pair of Aces, while Butt shows Q-Q. Bonyadi is crushing at his table, and now has over $1,800,000 in chips.

DinosaurMonster

07-12-2005, 09:05 PM

Hon Lee with 700k, is this the great and powerful "kamikaze kid"?

cokehead

07-12-2005, 09:07 PM

Date / Time: 2005-07-12 18:02:00
Title: Raymer Cracks Alejandro Pacheco
Log: Greg Raymer and Alejandro Pacheco get it all in on the turn, with the board showing K-K-3-4. Raymer has Pacheco covered. Raymer shows A-K, and Pacheco shows K-10. Both players have trips, but Raymer has the kicker. The river is a 2, and Raymer eliminates Pacheco. Raymer now has $1,570,000 in chips.

detroitplayer

07-12-2005, 09:08 PM

Can someone please post a link to the payout structure?

Quake1028

07-12-2005, 09:09 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Can someone please post a link to the payout structure?

[/ QUOTE ]
http://www.cardplayer.com/poker-tournaments/event.php?id=1269&screen=logs&type=3

cokehead

07-12-2005, 09:09 PM

http://www.cardplayer.com/poker-tournaments/event.php?id=1269&screen=logs&type=3

detroitplayer

07-12-2005, 09:14 PM

Thank you.

ohkanada

07-12-2005, 09:15 PM

Good way to end the level before dinner break for Greg. After being bluffed (maybe) and the incident, that hand should help his nerves.

Ken

Klepton

07-12-2005, 09:17 PM

it's possible raymer could have had 66-TT here and raise to get rid of a jack, so maybe he did fold the winner, but i still think he was bluffing also

Bill Murphy

07-12-2005, 09:20 PM

[ QUOTE ]
With the board showing J-5-5-A-5, Bonyadi bets out $80,000. Raymer raises to $230,000. Bonyadi then reraises $400,000 more, and Raymer finally folds. Bonyadi shows the King high bluff.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]

Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

How do they know it was a bluff?

Maybe he was value betting his King kicker?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bluffing with the best hand I think. Wouldn't Raymer call the flop with a J or pocket pair and call the reraise with an A? Gutsy play tho.

[/ QUOTE ]

I wish we knew how the action went on this hand, but I agree, I think Farzad had Greg beat. Greg's not gonna raise on the river w/33 or KT, KQ.

Maybe FB even figured that K was good and Greg would try to bluff w/something like T9, or maybe Greg thought he could push FB off QT or something.

Mild boo-boo by Greg, but it'll happen at this level and Bonyadi's a very, very good player. Didn't seem to slow Greg down much, either! /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 09:20 PM

From Cardplayer:

104. Rafael Perry
105. Joseph Chiosie
106. Mark Cole
107. Christopher Podlewski
108. George Huber
109. Matt Fitzpatrick
110. Gen Watanabe
These players all earned $54,965 for their efforts.
111. Joseph Simmons
112. Kevin Kim
113.
114. Louis Lo
115. Kun Nan Dollisan
116. Douglas Gehring
117. J.C. Tran
118. Stephen Deetz
119. Krystal Nelson
120. Tom Shaneberger
121. Paul Vicary
122. Alexander Dietrich
123. Bjorn Lindenberg
124. Joseph Toth
125. Kit Phaphon
126. Thomas Roupe
127. Brett Wiesner
128. BOb Hotchandani
129. Amit Sander
130. Chris Drozdowski
131. Dmitriy Eidelman
132. Howard Lederer
133. John Pappas
134. Joe Leibman
135. Adam Brosius
136. George Dickinson
137. Scott Numoto
138. Michael Cribb
139. Daniel Alaei
140. Paul Fisher

Kevin...

SumZero

07-12-2005, 09:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
How do they know it was a bluff?

Maybe he was value betting his King kicker?

[/ QUOTE ]

Bluffing with the best hand I think. Wouldn't Raymer call the flop with a J or pocket pair and call the reraise with an A? Gutsy play tho.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well Raymer might have laid down a K too. But yeah, odds are K-high was the best hand and almost certainly was not the worst hand.

Homer

07-12-2005, 09:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Ivey with almost 1 million in chips. This thing is over if Ivey gets the chip lead.

[/ QUOTE ]

Umm, no. Why do people say stuff like this?

Dynasty

07-12-2005, 09:24 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Ivey with almost 1 million in chips. This thing is over if Ivey gets the chip lead.

[/ QUOTE ]

Umm, no. Why do people say stuff like this?

[/ QUOTE ]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v720/DynastyPoker/shrug2.gif

Maybe http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v720/DynastyPoker/tinfoilhat3.gif?

pokergripes

07-12-2005, 09:24 PM

that when somebody starts a thread that should not be a separate thread, but says something bad or inflammatory about someone else, that it not both be left in place and frozen. IMO, better to either delete it (to restore the fewer number of threads), or leave it live, or even move it to the right existing thread.

Otherwise, somebody puts up an inflammatory post like yimyammer's about a known player (raymer--isn't it possible, just to answer yimyammer's "WTF?" question in his other thread, that raymer was responding to some kind of threat or otherwise worrisome thing, and that's why he told a guy who asked raymer's wife about his daughter to stay away from his family? If the story even is true, that is?), and it just gets left there, taking up space and for all to see, and yet nobody (including raymer, if he is so inclined) can respond to it.

Doesn't seem fair to me. IMHO /images/graemlins/smile.gif

AngusThermopyle

07-12-2005, 09:26 PM

From the WSOP website:
July 12, Tuesday Day 4, Start with 200 - 400 play down to 100-150

Last count I saw was 103 remaining.
They will play down to 27 tomorrow.

Just one more level today after dinner?

Dynasty

07-12-2005, 09:27 PM

I locked that thread so that I could restate why we have the stickied thread at the top of the forum.

It was a reall mess in here in Day 1A. It's been much better the last few days with the "official" stickied threads.

BS Yee

07-12-2005, 09:29 PM

I have no idea what Mike Paulle means:

Tuesday, 12th of July 2005 06:18 PM

Dinner break until 7:30. Please come back then.

Ralph Perry raised and called a reraise all-in from the button with A 5. Tim Phan had K 10 and a mountain of chips. The King flopped. Surprised?

If we were to stop now, Tiffany Williamson would be the second woman to make the WSOP Final Table and the first African-American leaving in England.

Sarah Bilney 240k
Freddy Bonyadi 1.6mm
Russ Hamilton 340k
Per Hildebrand 550k
Yakov Hirsch 530k
Can Hua 220k
Phil Ivey 800k
Kenna James 630k
John Juanda 1.1mm
Hung La 690k
Jason Lester 360k
Minh Ly 1.0mm
Mike Matusow 1.4mm
Terry Myers 360k
Tim Phan 2.0mm
Rod Pardey 800k
Greg Raymer 1.6mm
Russ Salzer 770k
Sheiky Shikhan 760k
Bryan Stellwagen 690k
Joseph Stillman 310k
Robert Turner 190k
Tommy Vu 900k
Jack Ward 230k
Lee Watkinson 520
Mike Wattel 190k
Tiffany Williamson 1.0mm

Dynasty

07-12-2005, 09:29 PM

[ QUOTE ]
From the WSOP website:
July 12, Tuesday Day 4, Start with 200 - 400 play down to 100-150

Last count I saw was 103 remaining.
They will play down to 27 tomorrow.

Just one more level today after dinner?

[/ QUOTE ]

The orginal plan was to play down to 100-150 today, down to 27 on Wednesday, and down to 9 on Thursday (at the Horseshoe).

However, I get the impression based on the limited information we have that they'll play a full day today ('til midnight or so) and get down as far as they can.

Bill Murphy

07-12-2005, 09:30 PM

locking it prevents it from being replied to(which deleting, oddly, does not do), therefore it quickly slips from view as new threads are started & old threads bumped.

[AHEM, koff, AHEM!] good thing someone suggested that these forums adopt the "bump" feature many moons ago.... /images/graemlins/blush.gif

Paxosmotic

07-12-2005, 09:32 PM

[ QUOTE ]
If we were to stop now, Tiffany Williamson would be the second woman to make the WSOP Final Table and the first African-American leaving in England.

[/ QUOTE ]
I really can not believe I need to point this out, but a key part of being African-American is that you're from America.

zuluking

07-12-2005, 09:34 PM

173 registered and 132 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Gees.

teamdonkey

07-12-2005, 09:34 PM

Date / Time: 2005-07-12 18:31:00
Title: Towne wins a big pot
Log: Eddie calls a big river all-in bet and shows the best hand, sending the player in Seat 3 packing. Greg Raymer says "nice call", to which Towne replies "He's got internet finger, clicks the imaginary mouse when he's got a big hand...that time he wasn't clicking."

masse75

07-12-2005, 09:34 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry, cut and paste from cardplayer. You would think their reporters would at least know hand rankings and how to read the board.

[/ QUOTE ]

Would you call this 'irony,' or 'par for the course?'

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 09:34 PM

I thought Tiffany's British, but I assume he meant first African-American living in England. Maybe I gave Paulle too much credit for giving Jackpot Jay the verbal smackdown.

Kevin...

masse75

07-12-2005, 09:36 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Raymer's The Boss:
It seems as if everyone at Raymer's table has seen what's he's capable of and they're allowing him to take down many pots uncontested. However, JC Tran has just been moved to Raymer's table, and currently has position on him, so stay with Card Player to see how many of these we can screw up.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP

Klepton

07-12-2005, 09:36 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Date / Time: 2005-07-12 18:31:00
Title: Towne wins a big pot
Log: Eddie calls a big river all-in bet and shows the best hand, sending the player in Seat 3 packing. Greg Raymer says "nice call", to which Towne replies "He's got internet finger, clicks the imaginary mouse when he's got a big hand...that time he wasn't clicking."

[/ QUOTE ]

crickets, seriously

ClaytonN

07-12-2005, 09:37 PM

Farzad Bonyadi

http://pokerdb.thehendonmob.com/pictures/2005WSOPEvent25WinnerFarzadBonyadi.jpg

Aliso Viejo, CA

Looks to have 3 bracelets, one in NLHE, one in LHE, and one in 2-7 triple draw lowball.

Won the 2.5 NLHE event this year, taking down a fairly weak field when it got down to 15 players or so

ClaytonN

07-12-2005, 09:39 PM

PITTM

07-12-2005, 09:39 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If we were to stop now, Tiffany Williamson would be the second woman to make the WSOP Final Table and the first African-American leaving in England.

[/ QUOTE ]
I really can not believe I need to point this out, but a key part of being African-American is that you're from America.

[/ QUOTE ]

pure gold...

rj

daveymck

07-12-2005, 09:41 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I thought Tiffany's British, but I assume he meant first African-American living in England. Maybe I gave Paulle too much credit for giving Jackpot Jay the verbal smackdown.

Kevin...

[/ QUOTE ]

She qualified at the Gutshot for I belive £10 she lives in UK but I think is American born.

ClaytonN

07-12-2005, 09:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
She qualified at the Gutshot for I belive £10

[/ QUOTE ]

This is all I really needed to hear.

Bill Murphy

07-12-2005, 09:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I have no idea what Mike Paulle means:

Tuesday, 12th of July 2005 06:18 PM

Dinner break until 7:30. Please come back then.

Ralph Perry raised and called a reraise all-in from the button with A 5. Tim Phan had K 10 and a mountain of chips. The King flopped. Surprised?

If we were to stop now, Tiffany Williamson would be the second woman to make the WSOP Final Table and the first African-American living in England.

[/ QUOTE ]

For the Perry-Phan hand, I think he meant that Phan's been catching good today.

As for the other thing, christ almighty. This where all the PC knot-tying blowsup. If TiffW was born in the US, than I guess what he stated is correct, albeit condescending and unnecessary.

If TW is a British citizen, than what he wrote is incredibly stupid.

EDIT: Jesus, I just re-read what he wrote. TiffW is the first black person from AMerica to ever live in the UK? lolololol

Well, them's the kinda mistakes white folk make when they over emphasize gender & esp. race, and look to insert it whenever possible.

REEDIT Or I guess he meant "the first African-American living in England" to make the final table. Sigh, clumsy and pointless.

BTW, based on what's been written elsewhere about TiffW's pace of play, how about the nickname of "The Sundial" if she makes the final table?

Or would that be racist/sexist?

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 09:47 PM

From what I've been reading about her on Gutshot, for an "Internet player", she plays really slow.

Kevin...

Homer

07-12-2005, 09:49 PM

[ QUOTE ]
From what I've been reading about her on Gutshot, for an "Internet player", she plays really slow.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
BTW, based on what's been written elsewhere about TiffW's pace of play, how about the nickname of "The Sundial" if she makes the final table?

[/ QUOTE ]

I prefer "zzzzzzzzzzzzzz".

Bill Murphy

07-12-2005, 09:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I really can not believe I need to point this out, but a key part of being African-American is that you're from America.

[/ QUOTE ]

Remember when Serena W won her first major, and the media initially called her "the first A-A to win one since Yannick Noah, uh, er, wait a min..."?

daveymck

07-12-2005, 09:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]
From what I've been reading about her on Gutshot, for an "Internet player", she plays really slow.

Kevin...

[/ QUOTE ]

It was a live tournie most the Gutshot players qualified in monday night satellites with a monthly final at the club.

touchfaith

07-12-2005, 09:51 PM

Gawd, who [censored] cares. The bitch is FUGLY beyond compare.

Black, white, blue, American, African, British...I could care less.

Shes Fugly

I am rooting for her to bust out soon so I don't have to see her on the final table on ESPN.

Klepton

07-12-2005, 09:52 PM

i think she's trying to stall

Sponger15SB

07-12-2005, 09:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I really can not believe I need to point this out, but a key part of being African-American is that you're from America.

[/ QUOTE ]

Remember when Serena W won her first major, and the media initially called her "the first A-A to win one since Yannick Noah, uh, er, wait a min..."?

[/ QUOTE ]

Not to be too racist, but if Tiffany makes the final table it won't mean [censored] compared to the publicity that a white woman would get for making a final table.

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 09:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
It was a live tournie most the Gutshot players qualified in monday night satellites with a monthly final at the club.

[/ QUOTE ]

I stand corrected, my apologies.

Kevin...

newfant

07-12-2005, 09:52 PM

Is she going to be the new face of poker?

http://www.gutshot.com/wsop/wsop2005dev/LIVE/tiffDay4.jpg

TimTimSalabim

07-12-2005, 09:54 PM

[ QUOTE ]
From what I've been reading about her on Gutshot, for an "Internet player", she plays really slow.

Kevin...

[/ QUOTE ]

She must be waiting for a "beep... beep... BEEP".

sexypanda

07-12-2005, 09:55 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
From what I've been reading about her on Gutshot, for an "Internet player", she plays really slow.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
BTW, based on what's been written elsewhere about TiffW's pace of play, how about the nickname of "The Sundial" if she makes the final table?

[/ QUOTE ]

I prefer "zzzzzzzzzzzzzz".

[/ QUOTE ]

I love it!

benza13

07-12-2005, 09:56 PM

SoftcoreRevolt

07-12-2005, 10:02 PM

Hope she doesn't have INTERNET FINGER

fnurt

07-12-2005, 10:03 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I really can not believe I need to point this out, but a key part of being African-American is that you're from America.

[/ QUOTE ]

Remember when Serena W won her first major, and the media initially called her "the first A-A to win one since Yannick Noah, uh, er, wait a min..."?

[/ QUOTE ]

My college newspaper once referred to Nelson Mandela as an African-American. Maybe they figured African-African would sound weird.

kayeshen

07-12-2005, 10:08 PM

on the chip count on card player, it lists "hon lee" at 700k in chips... is this hon lee as in "the kamikaze kid"?

AngusThermopyle

07-12-2005, 10:11 PM

on the chip count on card player, it lists "hon lee" at 700k in chips... is this hon lee as in where Puff the Magic Dragon frolicked in the autumn mist?

yimyammer

07-12-2005, 10:12 PM

What a minute, what do you mean saying I posted an inflamatory post?

My intent was sincere in that I wanted to know if anyone had further information about this. I didnt invent the report it was posted at Gutshot poker, see the report at:

http://www.gutshot.com/wsop/wsop2005dev/LIVE/daily_report_4.php

They made the report and I thought someone here might be able to elaborate. In no way did I intend to defame a guy I respect and am rooting for (Raymer). I wouldnt blame him for responding this way if he felt his family was being threatened.

Maybe it was a joke and I didnt get the punch line, but its an awefully strange thing to report if it wasnt accurate.

As far as posting in the right category, I have noted both Dynasty's comment and your concern and will be happy to comply.

Depalma

07-12-2005, 10:13 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Is she going to be the new face of poker?

http://www.gutshot.com/wsop/wsop2005dev/LIVE/tiffDay4.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

TW:
"Is he trying to flip me off....I'll kick your a**."

pokergripes

07-12-2005, 10:22 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I locked that thread so that I could restate why we have the stickied thread at the top of the forum.

It was a reall mess in here in Day 1A. It's been much better the last few days with the "official" stickied threads.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's much better the way you have it--I'm just saying in the one circ where somebody states what sounds like a pretty nasty rumor and has "WTF?" in the name of the thread, for example (that is, where there's something else at stake)...or just delete the post and tell the person to re-write it in the right thread if they want.

pokergripes

07-12-2005, 10:26 PM

[ QUOTE ]
What a minute, what do you mean saying I posted an inflamatory post?

My intent was sincere in that I wanted to know if anyone had further information about this. I didnt invent the report it was posted at Gutshot poker, see the report at:

http://www.gutshot.com/wsop/wsop2005dev/LIVE/daily_report_4.php

They made the report and I thought someone here might be able to elaborate. In no way did I intend to defame a guy I respect and am rooting for (Raymer). I wouldnt blame him for responding this way if he felt his family was being threatened.

Maybe it was a joke and I didnt get the punch line, but its an awefully strange thing to report if it wasnt accurate.

As far as posting in the right category, I have noted both Dynasty's comment and your concern and will be happy to comply.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think a natural reaction to the story (if it's even true--and note that key hands are at first being reported the opposite of what actually happened, so it might not be an accurate report) is to wonder what the guy said to raymer's wife that got that response, not to question why raymer would sound nuts...seems more likely that the lawyer and poker pro with tons of cash on the line is the one "in the right", all other things being equal... /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Didn't mean to sound harsh, really just had thought what I wrote above to Dynasty the last few times a post was locked...no worries /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 10:29 PM

The story was reported on tao of poker, gutshot and pokervoice, so I'd safely assume the incident happened.

Kevin...

touchfaith

07-12-2005, 10:29 PM

[ QUOTE ]
What a minute, what do you mean saying I posted an inflamatory post?

My intent was sincere in that I wanted to know if anyone had further information about this. I didnt invent the report it was posted at Gutshot poker, see the report at:

http://www.gutshot.com/wsop/wsop2005dev/LIVE/daily_report_4.php

They made the report and I thought someone here might be able to elaborate. In no way did I intend to defame a guy I respect and am rooting for (Raymer). I wouldnt blame him for responding this way if he felt his family was being threatened.

Maybe it was a joke and I didnt get the punch line, but its an awefully strange thing to report if it wasnt accurate.

As far as posting in the right category, I have noted both Dynasty's comment and your concern and will be happy to comply.

[/ QUOTE ]

WTF kind of elaboration do you want? Or are you just shocked and appauled that something like this could happen in Family Friendly Las Vegas?

I'm surprised that crap like this doesn't happen all the time. Actually, it probably does, just doesn't get reported.

I like and respect Greg, but me thinks he needs to take a chill pill and learn how to get security involved.

It's not being played at Disneyland (yet).

pokergripes

07-12-2005, 10:33 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The story was reported on tao of poker, gutshot and pokervoice, so I'd safely assume the incident happened.

Kevin...

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, point taken, but the broader point about who is likely to have been the "sane" person involved presumably still stands, and I think the tie has to go to the guy in the tourney with a chip lead, and known as an upstanding citizen (presumably at least until more info comes along!)... /images/graemlins/smile.gif

yimyammer

07-12-2005, 10:42 PM

No sweat, maybe I should have postured my question in a better way.

Im in agreement with you and given how great Raymer conducts himself at the table in virtually every video I've seen, my assumption was not that he was out of line, but justified in his response. I was merely curious if anyone knew anything further about what was said by the guy talking to his wife.

Heck, maybe its none of my business, but since it was posted at gutshot, it arroused my curiousity and I think they should have elaborated on their report or not said anything at all.

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 10:45 PM

Looks to be the table with Juanda/Williamson.

Kevin...

Brad22

07-12-2005, 10:45 PM

Where is the best site to find the most recent accurate chip counts for ALL players?

yimyammer

07-12-2005, 10:47 PM

LOL! You're funny.

I'd like to know what the guy said to Raymers wife and what about him made the comment seem threatening versus it being just a innocent question by a curious bystander.

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 10:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Where is the best site to find the most recent accurate chip counts for ALL players?

[/ QUOTE ]

Wait til there's 45 left and you may be in luck.

Kevin...

cokehead

07-12-2005, 10:51 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Where is the best site to find the most recent accurate chip counts for ALL players?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is not available right now.

renodoc

07-12-2005, 10:54 PM

Raymer is the bomb.

I do hope he learned his lesson from the Bellagio and is packing his buddy with him now.

Bill Murphy

07-12-2005, 11:00 PM

a couple hours ago, from pokervoice:

"John Juanda raises to 20,000 on Tiffany's big blind. She makes it 40 more, Juanda raises another 105,000 and Tiffany reraises another 105K! The raising war ends as John Juanda just calls and the flop comes 5, 2, 9 rainbow and Tiffany bets out the signature, for the hand, 105,000. John Juanda gives it up. We would love to tell you what she was holding but only she knows. Tiffany is up to 1.2 million!"

Sheesh, John, guess that'll show you, huh? wow...

mace25

07-12-2005, 11:02 PM

i am new to this thread today........ who is this tiffany chick? internet player? i saw a picture of her and she doenst look famaliar?

cokehead

07-12-2005, 11:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]
She qualified at the Gutshot for I belive £10 she lives in UK

[/ QUOTE ]

mace25

07-12-2005, 11:07 PM

hmmm i see

Bill Murphy

07-12-2005, 11:07 PM

Heretofore unknown, at least in the USA(tho she may be from USA originally), black woman from the UK.

Supposedly she got the clock called on her yea times yesterday.

Recliner

07-12-2005, 11:14 PM

Title: Raymer Takes a Hit
Log: With the board showing 7-5-3-K Greg Raymer bets $80,000 and Tex Barch calls. The river brings a 6. Barch bets out $400,000 and Raymer calls. Barch shows 9-8, for a rivered gutshot. Raymer ships over $500,000 to Barch on the hand and is down to $700,000 in chips.

mace25

07-12-2005, 11:14 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Heretofore unknown, at least in the USA(tho she may be from USA originally), black woman from the UK.

Supposedly she got the clock called on her yea times yesterday.

[/ QUOTE ]

yea times? = how many in us numbers?

Russ McGinley

07-12-2005, 11:15 PM

Tough break for Greg. Hope he bounces back.

TomHimself

07-12-2005, 11:16 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Title: Raymer Takes a Hit
Log: With the board showing 7-5-3-K Greg Raymer bets $80,000 and Tex Barch calls. The river brings a 6. Barch bets out $400,000 and Raymer calls. Barch shows 9-8, for a rivered gutshot. Raymer ships over $500,000 to Barch on the hand and is down to $700,000 in chips.

[/ QUOTE ]am i the only one who is puzzled by the river bet, is that a huge overbet or no? i guess not

Russ McGinley

07-12-2005, 11:18 PM

Maybe Greg had K4 or something.

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 11:18 PM

Reading previous updates on Gutshot, she's had the clock called on her several times.

Kevin...

Paxosmotic

07-12-2005, 11:19 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Title: Raymer Takes a Hit
Log: With the board showing 7-5-3-K Greg Raymer bets $80,000 and Tex Barch calls. The river brings a 6. Barch bets out $400,000 and Raymer calls. Barch shows 9-8, for a rivered gutshot. Raymer ships over $500,000 to Barch on the hand and is down to $700,000 in chips.

[/ QUOTE ]am i the only one who is puzzled by the river bet, is that a huge overbet or no? i guess not

[/ QUOTE ]
Probably an intentional overbet, the kind of bet that says "please don't call me", which incites a call.

scott8

07-12-2005, 11:20 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Title: Raymer Takes a Hit
Log: With the board showing 7-5-3-K Greg Raymer bets $80,000 and Tex Barch calls. The river brings a 6. Barch bets out $400,000 and Raymer calls. Barch shows 9-8, for a rivered gutshot. Raymer ships over $500,000 to Barch on the hand and is down to $700,000 in chips.

[/ QUOTE ]am i the only one who is puzzled by the river bet, is that a huge overbet or no? i guess not

[/ QUOTE ]

You are confused even though we dont actually know how much was in the pot??

Mano

07-12-2005, 11:23 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Raymer ships over $500,000 to Barch on the hand and is down to $700,000 in chips.

[/ QUOTE ]

Guessing pot had about $200K in it.

WackityWhiz

07-12-2005, 11:24 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Title: Raymer Takes a Hit
Log: With the board showing 7-5-3-K Greg Raymer bets $80,000 and Tex Barch calls. The river brings a 6. Barch bets out $400,000 and Raymer calls. Barch shows 9-8, for a rivered gutshot. Raymer ships over $500,000 to Barch on the hand and is down to $700,000 in chips.

[/ QUOTE ]am i the only one who is puzzled by the river bet, is that a huge overbet or no? i guess not

[/ QUOTE ]

You are confused even though we dont actually know how much was in the pot??

[/ QUOTE ]

Can't be much more than we can assume, since it says Raymer shipped 500k

RiverTheNuts

07-12-2005, 11:33 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Title: Raymer Takes a Hit
Log: With the board showing 7-5-3-K Greg Raymer bets $80,000 and Tex Barch calls. The river brings a 6. Barch bets out $400,000 and Raymer calls. Barch shows 9-8, for a rivered gutshot. Raymer ships over $500,000 to Barch on the hand and is down to $700,000 in chips.

[/ QUOTE ]am i the only one who is puzzled by the river bet, is that a huge overbet or no? i guess not

[/ QUOTE ]

Wonder what he had??? More info about blind position and such??

touchfaith

07-12-2005, 11:34 PM

lol, Greg takes a hit and everyone runs for the hills...The most active thread of the day goes quiet.

Bandwagoners

Mano

07-12-2005, 11:36 PM

Gutshot poker (http://www.gutshot.com/wsop/wsop2005dev/LIVE/daily_report_4.php) has the play of the hand from the flop on.

TomHimself

07-12-2005, 11:36 PM

[ QUOTE ]
lol, Greg takes a hit and everyone runs for the hills...The most active thread of the day goes quiet.

Bandwagoners

[/ QUOTE ]be quiet your getting annoying

PITTM

07-12-2005, 11:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
lol, Greg takes a hit and everyone runs for the hills...The most active thread of the day goes quiet.

Bandwagoners

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, youre right. or its the fact theyre on a break and there are no updates, i guess it COULD be that...

rj

theredwave

07-12-2005, 11:38 PM

Yes, it was almost one minute since someone made a post /images/graemlins/confused.gif

Gutshot has the hand different but shows the preflop and flop action. They have the flop checked, and Raymer putting in a 200,000 raise on the turn after Tex bet 50,000. I guess Burch thought his 10-high on the turn with a gutshot draw was good enough to put in 200,000 chips into an approximate 375,000 pot.

Howard Treesong

07-12-2005, 11:39 PM

Linky linky to the pic?

Russ McGinley

07-12-2005, 11:39 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Yes, it was almost one minute since someone made a post /images/graemlins/confused.gif

Gutshot has the hand different but shows the preflop and flop action. They have the flop checked, and Raymer putting in a 200,000 raise on the turn after Tex bet 50,000. I guess Burch thought his 10-high on the turn with a gutshot draw was good enough to put in 200,000 chips into an approximate 375,000 pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

You forget:

donkeys alwasy draw

touchfaith

07-12-2005, 11:40 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
lol, Greg takes a hit and everyone runs for the hills...The most active thread of the day goes quiet.

Bandwagoners

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, youre right. or its the fact theyre on a break and there are no updates, i guess it COULD be that...

rj

[/ QUOTE ]

Sad part is, you're serious...

Pssss, he took the hit after the break

They tore down Cloud-9 years ago...come down.

Kevmath

07-12-2005, 11:43 PM

Seat 1: Nick Gibson - $960,000
Seat 2: Michael Kessler - $580,000
Seat 3: Alex Morales - $380,000
Seat 4: Terry Burt - $440,000
Seat 5: Richard Kirsch - $400,000
Seat 6: Brad Kondracki - $610,000
Seat 7: Tiffany Williamson - $1,230,000
Seat 8: John Juanda - $840,000

Kevin...

mace25

07-12-2005, 11:46 PM

when is the final table broadcast?

PITTM

07-12-2005, 11:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
lol, Greg takes a hit and everyone runs for the hills...The most active thread of the day goes quiet.

Bandwagoners

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, youre right. or its the fact theyre on a break and there are no updates, i guess it COULD be that...

rj

[/ QUOTE ]

Sad part is, you're serious...

Pssss, he took the hit after the break

They tore down Cloud-9 years ago...come down.

[/ QUOTE ]

okay, youre right, this post is a ghosttown due to a raymer loss...

rj

Mano

07-12-2005, 11:50 PM

Date / Time: 2005-07-12 20:45:00

Player Amount Table Seat
Tim Phan $2,000,000 138 7
Farzad Bonyadi $1,860,000 119 4
Tex Barch $1,640,000 119 2
Bob Larson $1,500,000 131 7
Mike Matusow $1,500,000 128 9
Johnny Howard $1,250,000 118 4
Tiffany Williamson $1,200,000 129 7
Hon Lee $1,100,000 121 8
Steve Marx $1,020,000 128 1
Oskar Silow $1,000,000 119 6
John Juanda $1,000,000 129 8
Phil Ivey $950,000 118 2
Ray Sanchez $900,000 131 9
Minh Ly $880,000 120 1
Brad Kondracki $880,000 129 6
Russell Salzar $820,000 127 8
Larry Paigh $800,000 138 4
Rod Pardey Jr. $760,000 142 5
Greg Raymer $750,000 119 9
Kenna James $750,000 142 8
Hung La $710,000 131 8
Shawn Sheikhan $700,000 118 6
Brian Stelwagen $700,000 118 5
Kevin Kaikko $700,000 119 5
Patrick Hayden $650,000 142 1
Kevin McCarthy $607,000 132 7
Shane Bartholomew $560,000 120 5
Ron Ware $550,000 128 4
Per Hildebrand $550,000 142 3
Will O Brien $540,000 121 7
Jon Kalmer $540,000 118 1
Bernard Lee $535,000 132 6
Yakov Hirsch $530,000 121 5
Adam Friedman $520,000 128 8
Pat Madden $520,000 127 2
Jake Anonymous $500,000 120 7
Lee Watkinson $500,000 131 5
Roland Israabshvili $500,000 127 6
Samir Shakhtoor $460,000 119 7
Bart Rice $460,000 119 8
Ayhan Alsancar $460,000 132 4
Kevin Wright $450,000 128 5
Steve Donnenmann $450,000 142 6
Russell Hamilton $450,000 131 1
Aaron Kanter $450,000 120 8
Casper Christiansen $440,000 128 6
Tom Pniak $420,000 127 3
Niklas Flisberg $420,000 121 1
Joseph Hachem $420,000 132 8
Jarl Jorgensen $420,000 142 7
David Richardson $420,000 131 2
John McGrane $400,000 131 4
Terry Myers $400,000 138 9
Manny Minaya $390,000 138 6
Joe Stillman $390,000 120 6
Jose Rodriguez $370,000 121 3
Webber Kang $365,000 121 6
Jim Olson $360,000 128 2
James Butt $360,000 119 1
Sarah Bliney $360,000 131 3
Tony Abesamis $320,000 121 9
Bing Wang $310,000 118 3
Sean Daulat $300,000 127 9
CK Hua $300,000 127 5
Kelly Zoudo $300,000 132 9
Jason Lester $300,000 132 5
Vadim Shlez $300,000 132 1
Marcello Del Grosso $300,000 131 6
Connor Tate $290,000 120 9
Joe Berry $270,000 138 3
Derek Dix $270,000 138 8
Louie Calvo $265,000 121 4
Tom Sartori $265,000 128 3
Gabe Walls $250,000 120 3
Jon Lane $230,000 128 7
Dani Awad $220,000 121 2
Connor Joe $200,000 127 7
Jack Ward $190,000 118 8
Dustin Woolf $190,000 127 4
Richard Lapwood $180,000 132 2
Bryant King $180,000 138 1
Rob Turner $160,000 142 4

lightw1thoutheat

07-12-2005, 11:53 PM

Date / Time: 2005-07-12 20:50:00
Title: Update
Log: Phil Ivey has just doubled up.

(he had 950k at the last chip count, so this should put him just short of 2 mil)

go fossilman!

smurfitup

07-12-2005, 11:54 PM

he just doubled up... wow... scary thought

Kevroc

07-12-2005, 11:54 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Phil Ivey $950,000 118 2

[/ QUOTE ]

cardplayer says he just doubled up... that would make him chipp leader, wonder who he doubled through??

ok not quite chip leder but close

touchfaith

07-12-2005, 11:55 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Phil Ivey $950,000 118 2

[/ QUOTE ]

cardplayer says he just doubled up... that would make him chipp leader, wonder who he doubled through??

ok not quite chip leder but close

[/ QUOTE ]

I heard (somewhere) that this means its over now.

horne_dawg

07-12-2005, 11:55 PM

must of been
Johnny Howard $1,250,000 118

rid.br

07-12-2005, 11:56 PM

hohoho

go Ivey!

lightw1thoutheat

07-12-2005, 11:56 PM

Phil Ivey doubles through Brian Stellwagen
On a flop of [Kh][5d][Kd] Phil Ivey bet out and Brian Stellwagen pushed in. Ivey called his all in bet and the players turned up:

Brian Stellwagen [8c][8h]
Phil Ivey[Ad][Kc]

Ivey made a full house on the turn when it came [Ad]. The river [Th] was no help for Stellwagen. Phil Ivey doubled up.

from pokerwire

MCS

07-12-2005, 11:56 PM

Which suit is which?

You edited it already /images/graemlins/smile.gif

BlackAces

07-12-2005, 11:57 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Date / Time: 2005-07-12 20:50:00
Title: Phil Ivey Busts One
Log: With the flop showing K-K-5, Phil Ivey bets $50,000. Brian Stelwagen makes it $250,000 to go. Ivey makes it another $350,000 more to go. Stelwagen raises all-in, and Ivey instantaneously calls, and shows A-K. Stelwagen shows 8-8. Ivey has him covered and nearly doubles up to almost $2,000,000.

[/ QUOTE ]

ismisus

07-12-2005, 11:58 PM

Ivey is at 2 million, I unofficialy declare him GOd

pokerdirty

07-12-2005, 11:59 PM

this is sort of off topic, but i have to post this from today's "Jackpot Jay"

"The taping went well enough, I think. We engaged in some good-natured differences of opinions, and Paulle even set me up for an amusing story about always-entertaining Mike "The Mouth" Matusow, a frequent target of mine (the story ended with me getting my comeuppance). Afterward, as we were leaving, I tried to engage Paulle in a conversation about our respective narrative personae.

"Jay, how long have you been in this business?" he asked.

"About 40 years," I answered, assuming, wrongly, that he was talking about the journalism business.

"No, I mean poker."

"A little more than a year. Why?"

"Well," he said, "I've been in it all my life, so I don't need you to explain it to me.""

pwned.

TheMetetron

07-13-2005, 12:00 AM

Hellmuth would've laid it down fearing the obvious K5.

lightw1thoutheat

07-13-2005, 12:00 AM

Date / Time: 2005-07-12 20:55:00
Title: Raymer Gains Some Back
Log: After a flop of Q-J-6, Raymer checks. Bonyadi bets $30,000. Raymer calls. The turn is a 4. Raymer bets out $100,000. Bonyadi calls. The river is a Jack. Raymer bets $300,000. Boyadi calls again. Raymer shows 6-6 for a full house, and Bonyadi mucks. Raymer is back up to $1,300,000.

ohkanada

07-13-2005, 12:00 AM

Greg doubles up with a set!

mblax10

07-13-2005, 12:01 AM

Am I going to get flammed more for:
1.Asking how much longer till Ivey's eliminated either by AQ or while holding AQ?

2.Saying I really hope Matusow keeps it going and wins this thing.

SoftcoreRevolt

07-13-2005, 12:01 AM

I feel bad for everyone else still alive.

cookieb

07-13-2005, 12:01 AM

Gutshot has Raymer winning big pot with trip 6's, up over 1.8 again

Kevmath

07-13-2005, 12:02 AM

[ QUOTE ]
this is sort of off topic, but i have to post this from today's "Jackpot Jay"

"The taping went well enough, I think. We engaged in some good-natured differences of opinions, and Paulle even set me up for an amusing story about always-entertaining Mike "The Mouth" Matusow, a frequent target of mine (the story ended with me getting my comeuppance). Afterward, as we were leaving, I tried to engage Paulle in a conversation about our respective narrative personae.

"Jay, how long have you been in this business?" he asked.

"About 40 years," I answered, assuming, wrongly, that he was talking about the journalism business.

"No, I mean poker."

"A little more than a year. Why?"

"Well," he said, "I've been in it all my life, so I don't need you to explain it to me.""

pwned.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're about 11 hours (http://tinyurl.com/bvrup) off on that one, I win.

Kevin...

whalekock

07-13-2005, 12:02 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Ivey is at 2 million, I unofficialy declare him GOd

[/ QUOTE ] Is it an off day tommorow. Would he play the full tilt event.

Nottom

07-13-2005, 12:03 AM

that didn't take long

Kevmath

07-13-2005, 12:03 AM

There's no off days at the WSOP, so he's not playing on FSN tomorrow.

Kevin...

ismisus

07-13-2005, 12:05 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Ivey is at 2 million, I unofficialy declare him GOd

[/ QUOTE ] Is it an off day tommorow. Would he play the full tilt event.

[/ QUOTE ]

Juanda, Ivey, Matusow won't play! It good that Howard Lederer was knocked out so we could listen to some quality broadcasting.

Chobohoya

07-13-2005, 12:06 AM

Date / Time: 2005-07-12 20:59:00
Title: Daps
Log: Greg Raymer and his wife have just exchanged "daps."

Jack Bando

07-13-2005, 12:06 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Ivey is at 2 million, I unofficialy declare him GOd

[/ QUOTE ] Is it an off day tommorow. Would he play the full tilt event.

[/ QUOTE ]

No and No.

The Live FTP event goes in regardless of who from FTP is still alive in the WSOP. They probably will get replacements. Hellmuth and Duke are in it even they are from UB.

whalekock

07-13-2005, 12:07 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Ivey is at 2 million, I unofficialy declare him GOd

[/ QUOTE ] Is it an off day tommorow. Would he play the full tilt event.

[/ QUOTE ]

Juanda, Ivey, Matusow won't play! It good that Howard Lederer was knocked out so we could listen to some quality broadcasting.

[/ QUOTE ]
Do these guys qulify for the 10 million dollar Full Tilt bonus Promotion if the win the Main Event?

Brain

07-13-2005, 12:07 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Date / Time: 2005-07-12 20:59:00
Title: Daps
Log: Greg Raymer and his wife have just exchanged "daps."

[/ QUOTE ]

This is easy. Dap (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=dap)

Chobohoya

07-13-2005, 12:10 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Date / Time: 2005-07-12 20:59:00
Title: Daps
Log: Greg Raymer and his wife have just exchanged "daps."

[/ QUOTE ]

This is easy. Dap (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=dap)

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow. Good ol' backwoods Jacksonville. I thought that was called a "pound". I think it reads better that way... "Raymer just pounded his wife on the way back to the table after doubling up."

Brain

07-13-2005, 12:13 AM

The only place I regularly hear 'dap' being used is on PTI when Tony and Wilbon are screwing around.

mattrado

07-13-2005, 12:13 AM

[ QUOTE ]

Wow. Good ol' backwoods Jacksonville. I thought that was called a "pound". I think it reads better that way... "Raymer just pounded his wife on the way back to the table after doubling up."

[/ QUOTE ]

ahhh hah hah hah
out loud, seriously

CrazyEyez

07-13-2005, 12:15 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
How do they know it was a bluff?

Maybe he was value betting his King kicker?

[/ QUOTE ]

Bluffing with the best hand I think. Wouldn't Raymer call the flop with a J or pocket pair and call the reraise with an A? Gutsy play tho.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well Raymer might have laid down a K too. But yeah, odds are K-high was the best hand and almost certainly was not the worst hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

There's a Cardplayer video update w/ Rich whateverhisnameis where Raymer says he'd have won if he called, but wouldn't say what he had.

nyrush

07-13-2005, 12:16 AM

Since the odds are against him continuing to get bad beats with or against AQ, I see him winning the main event with that hand heads up against Raymer.

Bluff Daddy

07-13-2005, 12:16 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Ivey is at 2 million, I unofficialy declare him GOd

[/ QUOTE ] Is it an off day tommorow. Would he play the full tilt event.

[/ QUOTE ]

No and No.

The Live FTP event goes in regardless of who from FTP is still alive in the WSOP. They probably will get replacements. Hellmuth and Duke are in it even they are from UB.

[/ QUOTE ]

why would they schedule this for wed? whats wrong with next week

BlackAces

07-13-2005, 12:18 AM

I honestly think he can win this...

[ QUOTE ]
Date / Time: 2005-07-12 21:06:00
Title: Jon Lane Eliminated
Log: Jon Lane is eliminated by Mike Matusow when Matusow's pocket 4's make a set against Lane's top pair - Queens.

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pokerdirty

07-13-2005, 12:18 AM

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The only place I regularly hear 'dap' being used is on PTI when Tony and Wilbon are screwing around.

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wait for it...

Hold'me

07-13-2005, 12:21 AM

My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

mattrado

07-13-2005, 12:22 AM

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Since the odds are against him continuing to get bad beats with or against AQ, I see him winning the main event with that hand heads up against Raymer.

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the odds are always the same, I'm told.
-matt

Clarkmeister

07-13-2005, 12:22 AM

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My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

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Wow, that's a terrible price.

BlackAces

07-13-2005, 12:24 AM

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My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

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He's not going to win. He has to get dealt AQ sometime.

2+2 wannabe

07-13-2005, 12:24 AM

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My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

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Wow, that's a terrible price.

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yeah it's just barely +EV at that price right now

bettors must be really stupid

pokerdirty

07-13-2005, 12:25 AM

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My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

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Wow, that's a terrible price.

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last week it was, but as of right now....

Kevmath

07-13-2005, 12:25 AM

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[why would they schedule this for wed? whats wrong with next week

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There isn't a baseball All-Star game next week.

FSN would'nt be able to get the clearance needed to show a LIVE poker tournament.

Kevin...

detroitplayer

07-13-2005, 12:26 AM

oreogod

07-13-2005, 12:27 AM

wonder if Ivey will ever get a ESPN table.

Clarkmeister

07-13-2005, 12:29 AM

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My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

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Wow, that's a terrible price.

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last week it was, but as of right now....

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Sure, but the OP acts like 250-1 was a good price, which it clearly wasn't. I don't know who the best player in the tournament is, but I do know that taking 250-1 on him is definitely -EV.

Bill Murphy

07-13-2005, 12:30 AM

Next 9 get $107,950. Gettin' real interesting now...

Matusow at 1.3KK after busting number 82 w/a 3 outer on river /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Kevmath

07-13-2005, 12:31 AM

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My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

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Wow, that's a terrible price.

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last week it was, but as of right now....

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Sure, but the OP acts like 250-1 was a good price, which it clearly wasn't. I don't know who the best player in the tournament is, but I do know that taking 250-1 on him is definitely -EV.

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I think Ivey/Negreanu were co-faves at that price.

Kevin...

citanul

07-13-2005, 12:33 AM

why is 100k an arbitrary "interesting" number?

citanul

nyrush

07-13-2005, 12:33 AM

Exactly, which is why he will win eventually with or against AQ as a 66% favorite. Not because he has lost some many times, but because he will win the majority of the time.

Clarkmeister

07-13-2005, 12:33 AM

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I think Ivey/Negreanu were co-faves at that price.

Kevin...

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Wow. I think getting 250-1 on EITHER of them to win is a terrible bet, especially considering that it was assumed the field would be a full 6600 when the betting was taking place.

KneeCo

07-13-2005, 12:34 AM

Here's a first, me and Mike Matusow agree on something!
from cardplayer:
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Title: Ivey: "You are my idol"
Log: Mike Matusow walks by as Phil Ivey scoops a $300,000 pot off of Johnny Howard and exclaims, "You are my idol Phil!"

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Bill Murphy

07-13-2005, 12:34 AM

"Ivey has him covered and nearly doubles up to almost $2,000,000."

Then just now, 35 min later:

"Mike Matusow walks by as Phil Ivey scoops a $300,000 pot off of Johnny Howard and exclaims, "You are my idol Phil!" The Mouth's idol is sitting with just over a million. "

WTF?

horne_dawg

07-13-2005, 12:36 AM

Mike Matusow walks by as Phil Ivey scoops a $300,000 pot off of Johnny Howard and exclaims, "You are my idol Phil!" The Mouth's idol is sitting with just over TWO million chips

theredwave

07-13-2005, 12:36 AM

It says two million now.

AlwaysMore

07-13-2005, 12:36 AM

Refresh. They just changed it to "TWO."

Bill Murphy

07-13-2005, 12:37 AM

Because it has an extra digit? /images/graemlins/grin.gif

touchfaith

07-13-2005, 12:37 AM

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"Ivey has him covered and nearly doubles up to almost $2,000,000."

Then just now, 35 min later:

"Mike Matusow walks by as Phil Ivey scoops a $300,000 pot off of Johnny Howard and exclaims, "You are my idol Phil!" The Mouth's idol is sitting with just over a million. "

WTF?

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It was correct to TWO.

Don't tell me you are still counting on these reports to be accurate.

WackityWhiz

07-13-2005, 12:37 AM

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My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

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Wow, that's a terrible price.

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last week it was, but as of right now....

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Sure, but the OP acts like 250-1 was a good price, which it clearly wasn't. I don't know who the best player in the tournament is, but I do know that taking 250-1 on him is definitely -EV.

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I think Ivey/Negreanu were co-faves at that price.

Kevin...

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talk about bad prices, hellmuth was 40-1 to make the final table on sportsbook. lol

*edit, maybe it was 40-1 to cash... all i know is that phil was favored in something wsop related at 40-1

TeeJayORTj

07-13-2005, 12:38 AM

Its been changed to say "Over TWO million"

RowdyZ

07-13-2005, 12:38 AM

Cardplayer doesn't seem to have a clue according to these 2 logs 35 minutes apart Ivery lost a bunch of chips somewhere and cardplayer didn't cover it. He went from almost 2 million to just over 1 million AFTER dragging a 300K pot.
Would love to know how he lost that much so fast.

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Date / Time: 2005-07-12 20:50:00
Title: Phil Ivey Busts One
Log: With the flop showing K-K-5, Phil Ivey bets $50,000. Brian Stelwagen makes it $250,000 to go. Ivey makes it another $350,000 more to go. Stelwagen raises all-in, and Ivey instantaneously calls, and shows A-K. Stelwagen shows 8-8. Ivey has him covered and nearly doubles up to almost $2,000,000

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Then 35 minutes later
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Date / Time: 2005-07-12 21:25:00
Title: Ivey: "You are my idol"
Log: Mike Matusow walks by as Phil Ivey scoops a $300,000 pot off of Johnny Howard and exclaims, "You are my idol Phil!" The Mouth's idol is sitting with just over a million.

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touchfaith

07-13-2005, 12:38 AM

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I think Ivey/Negreanu were co-faves at that price.

Kevin...

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Wow. I think getting 250-1 on EITHER of them to win is a terrible bet, especially considering that it was assumed the field would be a full 6600 when the betting was taking place.

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lol, 250-1....You'd have to give me 10 iveys and 20 daniels for me to take that crap action.

TheMainEvent

07-13-2005, 12:39 AM

I was just about to reply with the correction, but I realized what was gonna happen...

Homer

07-13-2005, 12:43 AM

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My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

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Wow, that's a terrible price.

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yeah it's just barely +EV at that price right now

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Huh? Aren't there like 85 players left? He can't be more than 50-1 at this point. To get 250-1 would be way more than barely +EV.

gmunny

07-13-2005, 12:43 AM

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on the chip count on card player, it lists "hon lee" at 700k in chips... is this hon lee as in where Puff the Magic Dragon frolicked in the autumn mist?

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Is this the Hon Le who crushed a tablet and through it into the eyes of Frank Dux?
G$

Subfallen

07-13-2005, 12:44 AM

WTF? Now it has him in chip counts at 130k?? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

nyrush

07-13-2005, 12:44 AM

Why is Card Player messing up so much? They now have messed up the chip stacks page. For example they now have Raymer with 400,000 and Ivy with 130,000. Its bad enough that they mess up 1/4 of their updates and with only 80 players it still takes them an hour to post these stacks.

lightw1thoutheat

07-13-2005, 12:45 AM

Date / Time: 2005-07-12 21:39:00

Player Amount Table Seat

Phil Ivey $130,000 0 0

can cardplayer count?

Sponger15SB

07-13-2005, 12:45 AM

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My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

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He's not going to win. He has to get dealt AQ sometime.

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Hahaha ouchhhh

KneeCo

07-13-2005, 12:45 AM

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Date / Time: 2005-07-12 21:39:00

Player Amount Table Seat

Phil Ivey $130,000 0 0

can cardplayer count?

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I really really hope not! /images/graemlins/shocked.gif

Kevmath

07-13-2005, 12:47 AM

I'm sure that'll be fixed shortly, seems they haven't put the right name to the right stack yet.

Kevin...

Clarkmeister

07-13-2005, 12:47 AM

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My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

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Wow, that's a terrible price.

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yeah it's just barely +EV at that price right now

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Huh? Aren't there like 85 players left? He can't be more than 50-1 at this point. To get 250-1 would be way more than barely +EV.

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With 85 players and the chip lead (or close to it), I'd bet Ivey at about 20-1 or so, maybe a shade less.

lightw1thoutheat

07-13-2005, 12:48 AM

wsop is rigged, they just wanted people who bet on ivey to get their hopes up, then down, then up.

maybe its part of big brother's anti-gambling campaign

Kevmath

07-13-2005, 12:48 AM

It was 250-1 before the tournament started.

Kevin...

TheMainEvent

07-13-2005, 12:49 AM

Not possible, it has to be a typo. Someone else would need to have like 4 mil.

PartySNGer

07-13-2005, 12:51 AM

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Why is Card Player messing up so much? They now have messed up the chip stacks page. For example they now have Raymer with 400,000 and Ivy with 130,000. Its bad enough that they mess up 1/4 of their updates and with only 80 players it still takes them an hour to post these stacks.

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Yah, it's ridiculous. They could at least make sure their updates on Ivey and Raymer are correct. I have no clue where these two are sitting. I hope Phil has 2 mill and Raymer 1.3, but who knows?

lightw1thoutheat

07-13-2005, 12:53 AM

if it wasnt so ridiculously expensive, the wsop could have chips with a electronic sensor in them, making chip counts as easy as waving a electric wand over the chips.

they could get chip counts done so fast and accurately give them to the media.

Homer

07-13-2005, 12:54 AM

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My only regret is not betting like $10 on Phil Ivey to win the main event, the Bodog odds were like 250-to-1. Yikes!

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Wow, that's a terrible price.

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yeah it's just barely +EV at that price right now

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Huh? Aren't there like 85 players left? He can't be more than 50-1 at this point. To get 250-1 would be way more than barely +EV.

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With 85 players and the chip lead (or close to it), I'd bet Ivey at about 20-1 or so, maybe a shade less.

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I hadn't seen that he doubled from 1 to 2 mil. Thought he still only had 1.