I want to learn chess.

[adamstewart]

Like BusterStacks, I want to learn to play chess this summer.

I've always "played" chess occassionally for fun with friends. But I've never developed any particular strategy or deep understanding for the game.

I now want to change that. I don't want to become a pro, just a good player who can beat all the 'general public.'

Anyway, I just went to Chapter's tonight and picked up "First Chess Openings" by Eric Schiller. Seemed basic enough to start with. Anyone know this book, or any other good resources?

I'll close with this for now: Perhaps I'm wrong, but from my current understanding of chess, it is a game of complete information (unlike poker). If I lose any particular game, it's my fault - whereas a losing session in poker could simply be due to variance even though all decisions have been +EV. I'm intrigued by the possibility of having "full control" over one's destiny in this game.


Adam

[Popinjay]

Just learn a very basic opening for black and white. Then focus on all tactics. Tactics are the heart of chess and will allow you to easily crush any of your neophyte friends. The more experienced guys will be able to recommend some good tactics books.

My personal recommendation is don't get too involved in the game. There's just way too much memorization and boring crap involved in my opinion.

[Edge34]

[ QUOTE ]
Just learn a very basic opening for black and white.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm a personal fan of the 4-move checkmate. /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[vulturesrow]

Adam,

Lots of books out there, lots of websites. I like Chesscafe.com, read Dan Heisman's Novice's Nook column, including all the archives. Seriously. There are many good books. Lots of players like to dog SChiller, because he has put out some really crappy books, but I personally have found some of his books I Really like. For a first book, logical chess move by move by Irving Chernev is excellent. Dont worry too much about openings right now. Lots of beginners make this mistake. You also need a good book on tactical motifs, I think that Yasser Seirwan's Winning Chess Tactics is a great one to start with. Learning the basic tactical motifs and then doing problems is simply the best way to start off as a beginner.



[ QUOTE ]
Perhaps I'm wrong, but from my current understanding of chess, it is a game of complete information (unlike poker). If I lose any particular game, it's my fault - whereas a losing session in poker could simply be due to variance even though all decisions have been +EV. I'm intrigued by the possibility of having "full control" over one's destiny in this game

[/ QUOTE ]

Well it is a game of complete information in the sense that you know exactly what the balance of power is between you and your opponent. But you still have to be anticipate your opponents range of moves, which ones he is most likely to make, etc. And be aware, there is little to no sucking out in chess. The greater the distance between your rating and another players, the lesser chance you are going to luck into a win.

For practice, you can play on the Free Internet Chess Server or at the ICC (I forget what the initials stand for). FICS is free, ICC isnt unless you play anonymous. Stay away from Yahoo chess /images/graemlins/smile.gif Hope this helps, good luck, chess is a very fun game.

[Alobar]

[ QUOTE ]
Stay away from Yahoo chess /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

just curious...why??

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
My personal recommendation is don't get too involved in the game. There's just way too much memorization and boring crap involved in my opinion.

[/ QUOTE ]

There is no reason that a player that practices tactics regularly and understands basic opening principles cant push his rating to around 1800 or so (playing online). There is no need to get into memorizing opening lines up to that point. I should add that you should know some basic endgames as well, but those dont require much memorization.

[vulturesrow]

Filled with cheaters and rude kids. /images/graemlins/smile.gif I will say that I used it from time to time to practice opening lines but you can get all you need playing on FICS or ICC.

[adamstewart]

[ QUOTE ]
cheaters

[/ QUOTE ]

How does one cheat at chess?


Adam

[adamstewart]

thanks for the excellent and comprehensive reply.


(I may have further questions for you down the road. /images/graemlins/wink.gif)


Adam

[Edge34]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
cheaters

[/ QUOTE ]

How does one cheat at chess?


Adam

[/ QUOTE ]

The only thing I can think of in my use of Yahoo Chess is that a great number of players will quit a game in order to avoid an actual loss, and maybe harass you if you don't accept their draw offers when they're way behind. Not cheating, but definitely annoying.

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
cheaters

[/ QUOTE ]

How does one cheat at chess?


Adam

[/ QUOTE ]

Use computer programs to make the moves. In other words they have a computer playing program opened at the same time as they are playing you. They make your move and see how the computer responds. Then that is the move they make. FICS and ICC combat this in different ways. Yahoo, at least the last that I knew, doesnt.

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
thanks for the excellent and comprehensive reply.


(I may have further questions for you down the road. /images/graemlins/wink.gif)


Adam

[/ QUOTE ]

Youre welcome. Let me know if you want to play online some time. I havent played in quite some time actually so I am very rusty but I can still talk you through some basic tactics and opening principles. Hopefully some other people weigh in because I know there are some very good chess players lurking around these forums.

[blaze666]

here's a tip for the person who has played a bit but never looked at strategy, try and find knight forks and pincers to hold opponent pieces in place, you propabaly know that already. i tried to learn chess about a fortnight ago, and i just wanted pretty much the same thing, you know to beat the the average guy. then i realsied 2 things:

1. the average guy is going to be your drinking buddy or something, and you 2 are't going to have the concentration to play chess. you can have a 'quick game of whist' or something, but there's no such thing as a 'quick game of chess'

2. if i wanted to be a serious player, there was no hope of me ever becoming any good, because the field is just too large to get anywhere.


but if you still want to learn how to play chess, the basic strategy can be found here: a very useful chess site. (http://www.princeton.edu/~jedwards/cif/intro.html)

[fluxrad]

Personally, I'd recommend Silman's How To Reassess Your Chess. It moved me from a ~1000 to a ~1300 player before I slacked off. Here are a couple of general tips:

1. Don't spend too much time on openings if you're just learning the game. You can have all the best openings memorized 15 moves deep and you're still screwed the moment you hit the end-game.

2. Get yourself a set you can take down to the local bar/coffee shop/hang out and play as many people as you can.

3. Get yourself an account on FICS (http://www.freechess.org/). That's probably the best place to play.

3a. Don't play blitz until you know what you're doing. "2 12" can make you worse if you're just starting out.

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
Personally, I'd recommend Silman's How To Reassess Your Chess.

[/ QUOTE ]

I love Silman's books but I wouldnt recommend it to someone starting out. It wont be useful with out having basic tactics down.

[Arnfinn Madsen]

I know a few decent players (world class) and would sum up as follows:

Basically you become better each time you play an opponent that is better than you and worse each time you play a worse one. Blitz chess damages your game when you lack experience (when you have experience you are quick enough to use it to test different things). Play games with high time limits and spend at least a minute considering each position. If it is an interesting position, spend 10 minutes. NEVER do a move just to move, keep looking until you find a move that achieves something. This consciousness will slowly open your brain for the magic.

[zephed]

1.e4...

[Punker]

Schiller books are not good.

I advise picking up the "Winning Chess..." series by Silman and Seirawan. There's 3-4 books, all pretty inexpensive.

Play on FICS at www.freechess.org. (http://www.freechess.org.) I've been playing there for 10+ years.

Play whoever you can live. Don't be one of those people who thinks they have to "be good" before you can play in public. Accept that you will have to lose hundreds of games to get good.

[bugstud]

you spelled thousands wrong

I'll amen the seirawan book rec, especially the tactics one. Probably the one most responsible for me getting decent.

[JoshuaD]

[ QUOTE ]
1.e4...

[/ QUOTE ]

More like 1.c4. It pwns everyone.

[Bob Moss]

Get a book or two on endgame first. It's much more interesting and fun. Sort of like post-flop play. Although in limit hold'em I feel like it's impossible to be a winning player without solid preflop play, it is much less essential in chess, at the level that you and your opponents will likely be. Endgame is the easiest part to play, followed by the middle game, so learn in this order.

Bob

[Vote4Pedro]

Yasser Seirawan has a nice series of books. I started with the "Winning Chess Openings" and had a lot of success with it. Someone recommended staying away from Yahoo chess, however, I think its a great way to learn and work on basics. There are also a shitload of computer programs that will definitely help a beginning player.

[bugstud]

[ QUOTE ]
Yasser Seirawan has a nice series of books. I started with the "Winning Chess Openings" and had a lot of success with it. Someone recommended staying away from Yahoo chess, however, I think its a great way to learn and work on basics. There are also a shitload of computer programs that will definitely help a beginning player.

[/ QUOTE ]

fics has anti-cheat crap, real interface and competent opponents. substantially better than yahoo in all respects.


www.freechess.org (http://www.freechess.org)

[zephed]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1.e4...

[/ QUOTE ]


More like 1.c4. It pwns everyone.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm just a newbie, I'll look into that though. Thanks. I guess this will get you off the hook for that crappy post about Led Zeppelin.

[Reef]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1.e4...

[/ QUOTE ]


More like 1.c4. It pwns everyone.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm just a newbie, I'll look into that though. Thanks. I guess this will get you off the hook for that crappy post about Led Zeppelin.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm pretty sure 1. e4 is better.

[Reef]

beginners only need to know the following order of development for their opening repetoire: center pawns, knights, bishops, castle, rooks, Queen. Memorizing the specific order of openings can be counter productive, imo. tactics are a MUST.

[Biloxi]

I started really "studying" chess 6 months ago and its easy to go over board. For openings just pick out two basics and memorize them. (ex:Sicilian, Queens Gambit..)
Middle game is alot of logical decisions which are natural for me and can be developed over time by most. There are plenty of websites that can help you out. And most of them have many demonstrations and examples of endgame and openings. And you can watch replays of GM games while they explain.

[Biloxi]

check out instantchess.com for some quick games while at work or if you have a few spare minutes

[TStoneMBD]

i started to get into chess a little bit because i find the study im putting into it enjoyable. i havent read any books, but have been using chessgames.com and computer program shredder classic.

chessgames.com allows you to watch thousands upon thousands of games from all the best players in the world. ive watched a ton of bobby fischer games and as a result, have a very good idea for opening starting moves along with middle and end games. before coming to this site, i was pretty decent at chess. i opened with queens pawn and had a pretty good idea for middle games, but had horrible end game strategy. i now realize that queens pawn pretty much blows. i couldnt put people into checkmate. i would always win by building a material advantage and then trading until the board is empty. now i feel that i have a good idea of checkmate combinations and have been able to checkmate opponents early in games, something which i could never have done before.

shredder classic supposively won the national computer application championships, meaning that it is the most sophisticated computer chess player in the world, at least for its time. obviously i could never build an advantage against it, and it of course can be frustrating to lose every game over and over again, but i learned so much from it. you can download the program off download.com, but its a trial version and costs a few bucks to continue if you want to.

[TimM]

If any of you would like one of your games analyzed, you can send it to me by PM and I will post the analysis here. I think that would be a good way for all who are interested to learn.

[vulturesrow]

You are right, this is definitely a great way to supplement your studies. If you like this sort of study, here are some books that I recommend (and I own all of them, so consider these first-hand recommendations).

Logical Chess Move by Move (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0713484640/qid=1119827189/sr=8-2/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i2_xgl14/002-8238349-7751201?v=glance&s=books&n=507846) - Great beginner's book

Winning Chess Brilliancies (Winning Chess Series) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1857443470/qid=1119827271/sr=8-6/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i6_xgl14/002-8238349-7751201?v=glance&s=books&n=507846) - Another great one for beginners. Its by Yasser Seirwan, who has a real gift for explaining the flow of a chess game.

Chess Master vs. Chess Amateur (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0486279472/qid=1119827368/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/002-8238349-7751201?v=glance&s=books&n=507846) - This one is a bit dated but still very good.

Mammoth Book of the World's Greatest Chess Games (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0786705876/qid=1119827430/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/002-8238349-7751201?v=glance&s=books&n=507846) - This is probably my favorite. Written by 3 very good chess players, covers a wide variety games from throughout chess history. Great balance of analysis and explanation. I hope they update this one soon.

Best Lessons of a Chess Coach (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0812922654/qid=1119827531/sr=8-2/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i2_xgl14/002-8238349-7751201?v=glance&s=books&n=507846) - This book is interactive and is great for teaching the "whys" of certain moves.

[JoshuaD]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1.e4...

[/ QUOTE ]


More like 1.c4. It pwns everyone.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm just a newbie, I'll look into that though. Thanks. I guess this will get you off the hook for that crappy post about Led Zeppelin.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm pretty sure 1. e4 is better.

[/ QUOTE ]

Depends. Especially at the lower levels everyone's familiar with e4, but they won't be with c4. You can get a bigger advantage by taking advantage of their weaknesses.

At a master level I think e4 is better.

[vulturesrow]

One thing with 1.c4 is that is has a lot of transpositional possibilities in it. So its something at master level you have to be very aware of. But I do agree at lower levels it is good for taking people out of their pet openings. I really liked The Dynamic English (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1901983145/qid=1119827975/sr=8-6/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i6_xgl14/002-8238349-7751201?v=glance&s=books&n=507846) by Tony Kosten.

[TStoneMBD]

i think you are right about this. bobby fischer used to start off with c4 during his amateur days and of course switched to e4. right now i open with c4 because i have the moves memorized a mere 8 turns deep.

[bugstud]

[ QUOTE ]
i think you are right about this. bobby fischer used to start off with c4 during his amateur days and of course switched to e4. right now i open with c4 because i have the moves memorized a mere 8 turns deep.

[/ QUOTE ]


....

define his "amateur" days, anyway. Pretty sure he was an e4 guy even then.

[TStoneMBD]

watch his matches in 1955 and 1956 on chessgames.com. he opened with c4 in the majority of them. i dont know which year he changed to e4 though, it could have been several years afterwards as i havent seen those matches yet. some of those tournaments were "junior" events and "amateur" championships.

[bugstud]

[ QUOTE ]
watch his matches in 1955 and 1956 on chessgames.com. he opened with c4 in the majority of them. i dont know which year he changed to e4 though, it could have been several years afterwards as i havent seen those matches yet. some of those tournaments were "junior" events and "amateur" championships.

[/ QUOTE ]

it was right around then, for certain. I'm pretty sure he only opened e4 in the US championships and he started those in '57 IIRC.

[Popinjay]

Chess videos (http://chess.fm/)

They're free and a nice way to learn as well.

[David Ottosen]

Having full control of your destiny is a two edged sword... /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[TStoneMBD]

sorry guys i feel foolish, he didnt open with c4 he opened with knights pawn or knight to c3. the whole lettering/number system is still confusing to me.

[KingDan]

Anyone up for a game, I play on chessclub.com and freechess.org handle KingDan on both.

Btw, e4 pwns. C4 is for pussies.

[dhaimon]

[ QUOTE ]
1. the average guy is going to be your drinking buddy or something, and you 2 are't going to have the concentration to play chess. you can have a 'quick game of whist' or something, but there's no such thing as a 'quick game of chess'


[/ QUOTE ]

What? You never played bullet?

[DavidC]

Well...

Let's see.

First, learn tactics, because that's how games are won and lost.

Second, learn strategy, so that you can figure out what the hell's going on in the openings (this is stuff like pawn structure, and other things that I can't remember, it's been a while..).

To be honest, strategy is just long-long-long-term tactics, when you boil it down. It's just easier for a human mind to do strategic judgement than it is to accurately calculate tactical moves 30 moves in advance.

Third, learn openings. They're nice to know. Learn a few common ones first. But ultimately, let strategy be your guide.

For whatever reason, I love King's Gambit, and that weird one that starts with 1.e3

(Not sure what this is called, but it eventually brings both bishops to the center for a king-side attack).

This kinda makes me want to play chess again...

... wish chess.net was still free. Yahoo blows. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Anyone know of a good place to play online?

[DavidC]

... oh yeah, and learn all the checkmates (and I mean ALL the checkmates). In a timed game, you miss out on a lot if you have to figure it out as you go, rather than just memorizing them.

[zephed]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1.e4...

[/ QUOTE ]


More like 1.c4. It pwns everyone.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm just a newbie, I'll look into that though. Thanks. I guess this will get you off the hook for that crappy post about Led Zeppelin.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm pretty sure 1. e4 is better.

[/ QUOTE ]

Depends. Especially at the lower levels everyone's familiar with e4, but they won't be with c4. You can get a bigger advantage by taking advantage of their weaknesses.

At a master level I think e4 is better.

[/ QUOTE ]
So, in your experience it is a good low-limit chess move?

[zephed]

Also, does anyone know of any flexible computer AI programs? I've downloaded a few free programs and there is one thing or another I don't like about them.

I want to play against a computer that can adjust it's "skill" level down to my level.

I'd be willing to shell out a few bucks.

[JaBlue]

[ QUOTE ]


My personal recommendation is don't get too involved in the game. There's just way too much memorization and boring crap involved in my opinion.

[/ QUOTE ]

This opinion is way uninformed. I would wager that I will beat PopinJay afer playing 1. a3 which will stop all possibility of memorized opening variation.

While it is true that opening theory is constantly changing, it is not true that it requires memorization or being boring. Opening theory develops from actual games played. How could it be boring to go through those games if you like chess? As for memorizing the opening lines, it is a common mistake that poor players make that they simply try to repeat the moves rather than understand them. If you understand the opening you will have no need for memorization.

[JaBlue]

Would you do a serious analysis - as if it were your own game?

Generally it takes me 4-6 hours to analyze my games and it is hard work, so why you would offer this service is beyond me. But I may have to cash in on it to compare results next time I have an interesting game /images/graemlins/smile.gif.

[Chiron]

Has anybody ever played "bughouse"? God that was fun to play with the other kids, back in my chess tournament days.

[CallMeIshmael]

Have you tried the Chessmaster series?

Its the most popular commercial chess software.

[JaBlue]

I am not sure how serious you are about chess, but I will write this anyway. This will help you become a very strong club level player if not master if you take it seriously.

When you are first starting out, the most important things are basic endings and tactics. Most games are won when there is a material imbalance that you can exploit in the endgame; i.e. you have an extra queen, an extra knight, etc. However, what will an extra queen give you if you don't know how to checkmate somebody when you have a queen and a king against their lone king?

The tactics will help you get winning position, the endgame will help you win the won position.

I don't know any basic endgame books but I am sure that it is not hard to find one.

As for tactics, you should get some problem books. The best ones are Convekta's Manual of Combinations vol. 1-3. A good book is also Reinfeld's 1001 sacrafices and combinations (or something like that).

I suggest to study tactics minimum of 30 minutes a day (solve problems).

Also important to your game is to see some games of old masters to inspire your play. I suggest getting an annotated collection of Paul Morphy's games. Frisco Del Rosario has published one that would serve as a great introduction to the beauty of chess for any beginning player. Go through these games and understand the important principles of the opening: fighting for the center, development, etc. When you feel as if you can understand Morphy's play very well, move on to the next step:


Once you have a basic understanding of tactics you will need to learn how to make plans and how to play the game. How you should decide what to do, and how you should pursue it. The best book for this is far and above Aron Nimzowitsch's My System.


The above steps will help you a lot to learn by reading, however you will need practice. I would suggest finding a local club that offers tournaments in a longer time control. Play your games seriously and then analyze them after. Write down your comments on where you made mistakes, and where you adopted an inaccurate plan. This will take forever and is a huge pain in the ass, but if you are a sportsman and hate to lose you will realize how necessary it is. The Russians say that when you lose a chess game a small piece of you dies. If you feel this way you will be compelled to perform an autopsy. This is your game analysis and it is critical to development.

These thigns are all very important for you to do in orer to develop as fast as possible. Taking private lessons can also help. If you ask around at your local chess club you can probably find a mentor who will provide his services at a reasonable fee. Taking a lesson for a couple hours once a week should be enough. Most development will happen from your own hard work.


Lastly you should remember that there are certain stages to a chess development, like evolutions. The way that chess players learn is they are on one level and are constantly storing and harvesting information. Once they have internalized enough of it, they will jump to the next level and start internalizing new information. Each progressive level will be higher and farther away then the last, but once you "explode" to the next level, you won't come back. For instance if in 20 years Kasparov never thought about chess and then played a master, he would still crush him. He's just on a different level.

Anyway, I hope that helps, and if you have any more questions feel free to shoot me a PM.

[gumpzilla]

[ QUOTE ]

I don't know any basic endgame books but I am sure that it is not hard to find one.

[/ QUOTE ]

Seirawan has one (Winning Chess Endings) that's pretty well written, as far as these things go, and covers all the basics.

[tolbiny]

WE are in exactly the same situation right now. A couple of weeks ago i took out nearly 20 Chess books from the library- obviously i won't read them all, but i skim them untill i read one that seems lie it fits me well- so far the best ones have been
Best lessons of a Chess coach by
Sunil WEeeramantry
and
Killer chess tactics
by keene
schiller and
shamkovich

[SpearsBritney]

Books are good, but I think this (http://chessmaster10.ubi.com/us/features.php) would be even better for now.

[Bill C]

Hi, ADAM,

Chessmaster is excellent, and I recommend it.

Most cities of any size have chess clubs, and those clubs invariably have ways to help newcomers learn the game. It is a game that is best learned by playing with someone a little better than you are, and discussing moves as you go.

It's a great game. Have fun with it!

bill c

[bugstud]

[ QUOTE ]
Has anybody ever played "bughouse"? God that was fun to play with the other kids, back in my chess tournament days.

[/ QUOTE ]


hi /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[steaknshake925]

[ QUOTE ]
Logical Chess Move by Move - Great beginner's book

[/ QUOTE ]

this is a REALLY good book. i'd get it if u get no other chess books.

[KingDan]

[ QUOTE ]
Has anybody ever played "bughouse"? God that was fun to play with the other kids, back in my chess tournament days.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am ridicously overrated on ICC bug, top rated 2800 or something before quitting. Bug stopped being fun for... I'd rather play chess, poker, or now Halo 2 online /images/graemlins/smile.gif

If you want top bug competition play on FICS.

[JaBlue]

Schiller is terrible and I am not the only one that will tell you this. I urge you to stay away from his books. Check out my reply "All You Need" or something like that for better recommendations.