AJ in at a discount out of position

[JimmyV]

15/30 Party mid-morning. Some fish, plenty of solid types. One of the latter, nicknamed 'superloose,' raises under the gun and gets one fishy cold-caller. I'm in the SB with A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] and call. I imagine my image is pretty tight but who knows? BB folds.

Flop 3 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

I check, UTG bets, loose-passive calls, I call.

Turn 7 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. UTG bets, fish folds, I call.

River 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. I bet, UTG raises, I fold.


Comments?

[DcifrThs]

[ QUOTE ]
15/30 Party mid-morning. Some fish, plenty of solid types. One of the latter, nicknamed 'superloose,' raises under the gun and gets one fishy cold-caller. I'm in the SB with A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] and call. I imagine my image is pretty tight but who knows? BB folds.

Flop 3 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

I check, UTG bets, loose-passive calls, I call.

Turn 7 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. UTG bets, fish folds, I call.

River 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. I bet, UTG raises, I fold.


Comments?

[/ QUOTE ]

i like you letting superloose betting your hand for you since its likely you outkick him if he has an ace or he'd bet his kk, qq, jj the same way.

but the river play was quite flawed. but i think you can see why...you put a bet in the pot and didn't get the showdown you had a decent chance of winning. superloose folks raise with aces no kicker. i am SURE the river was check call given the way you played.

preflop however i'm a little mixed. in your shoes i think i'd call.

but now thinking about it you didn't say whether superloose was loose aggressive or passive. if he's aggressive you played fine...but if he's passive i'd bet out and expect him to raise with a better hand so i can fold and only lose a bet.
but given he raised preflop its unlikely he's too passive.

in any case i think the only street you really misplayed was the river. at the very least the check call gains you info about his early position raising standards even if you lose (but i still think the call is worth it without that info).

-Barron

[astroglide]

i generally hate the standard "check/call check/call bet" routine with stuff like kk on an ace board on board, AJ on an ace on board, etc because partypoker unknowns will raise the hell out of you with nothing when you come to life on the river; it looks like you're trying to steal the pot. it's not terribly often i'll be able to fold to a raise on the river (i would need notes/stats on them).

[JimmyV]

[ QUOTE ]
it looks like you're trying to steal the pot. it's not terribly often i'll be able to fold to a raise on the river (i would need notes/stats on them).

[/ QUOTE ]

When my opponents do this in the small blind it looks to ME like they spiked two pair. I need quite a hand to raise them; certainly better than one pair third kicker; or I need to be on a stone-cold bluff from the get-go.

So you'd check-call the river? Aren't you wasting a bet when he checks behind?

[DcifrThs]

yea i didn't even address the actual fold there...i just thought its retarded to bet and fold for a raise if you can check and call.

with that board though i think the raiser will bet more hands more often (on the later streets) that you can beat but won't call with those same hands the whole way...thats why i think his play was fine.

in any case, the river play is what i was referring to.

take care,
Barron

[DcifrThs]

[ QUOTE ]

So you'd check-call the river? Aren't you wasting a bet when he checks behind?

[/ QUOTE ]

better than wasting the POT if you fold to a raise.

[JimmyV]

How often would YOU bluff-raise the river here? Thirty-dollar bills don't just grow on trees, you know.

And astro, if it "looks like I'm trying to steal the pot," why raise? Why not just call and take my bet? If I'm just trying to steal it I'm not going to CALL the raise, am I?

I don't think you guys are putting yourselves in my opponent's shoes here at all. Maybe he had 55 and rivered a set, in which case I'm the dummy, but I definitely don't think I'm the weak-tight kind of dummy.

JimmyV

[astroglide]

i'd rather lose a bet than lose the entire pot. if the person is a fish, i'll bet and call a raise. if they're a rock, i'll bet and fold to a raise. if i'm not sure, i'll check because a raise will make me want to puke.

[astroglide]

do you regularly play the 15/30 on partypoker? people can raise with busted hands or weak pairs here, suspecting weakness.

[Gabe]

I like playing the hand like this against typical players at least in a B&M. I would vary from this if he bluffed a lot, bet weak hands on the river, or was unpredictable.