Did I misplay these quads?

chesspain · #1 02-10-2004, 09:57 PM

Paradise 1/2...fairly passive and surprisingly loose table, with 45% seeing the flop.

I'm in MP1 and dealt 6 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

UTG calls, folded to me and I call, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, folded to the button who raises, folded to BB who calls, UTG and I both call, MP2 calls, MP3 limp-three-bets, all five call...six to the flop for 9BB.

6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Checked to me and I check, MP2 checks, MP3 bets, button calls, BB calls, UTG calls, I call, MP2 calls...six to the turn for 12BB.

[6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Checked to me and I bet, folded to MP3 who raises, folded back to me and I three-bet, MP3 calls...headsup for 18BB.

[6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]] A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I bet, MP3 calls...

Although I dragged a nice pot, should I:

1) ...have checkraised on the flop, which could have gathered a few more SBs but possibly spooked anyone from getting aggressive on later streets?

2) ...have gone for the checkraise on the turn, and hoped that MP3 would have remained aggressive and bet, which could have prompted a few more callers before my checkraise, rather than betting out and allowing MP3 to clear the field?

kungfuaaron · #2 02-10-2004, 11:16 PM

Can you explain to me why you saw 3 bets with 66 in MP1 preflop? I'm relatively new to the game and 3 bets for 66 seems a little extreme to me. Heck, I probably would have dropped 66 to a raise-reraise.

chesspain · #3 02-10-2004, 11:26 PM

After the button raised, and it was back to me for one more bet, I was getting 5:1 to spike a set, given the very high likelihood that the other limpers would call. After it got reraised, I was still getting 5:1 to call, as there was only one player left to act after me, who was undoubtedly going to call. Even though my immediate pot odds were insufficient, the likelihood that I would get action from one or more players after the flop if I hit my set made this an easy call.

bunky9590 · #4 02-10-2004, 11:31 PM

flop:
Lead into the raiser. smoothcall the raise.

Turn check raise is a viable option especially if you smoothcall the raise. I would still prefer to lead out and have a shot at a three bet. If he raises, three bet and/or cap if possible.

Gotta bet the river. (obviously)

CMangano · #5 02-11-2004, 12:36 AM

Slowplaying is almost never correct. On the flop the pot is huge, your goal should be to maximize your chances of winning this pot. At this point...

Ok, Ok, just kidding. But, I do think slowplaying was not the correct move here. On the flop the bet comes two players to your left with a bunch of callers. A raise here will probably only knock out one player and trap everyone else. Plus, if MP3 3 bets you will surely get a few callers for 2 extra bets.

The only thing I can think about your bet out on the turn is you didn't want to risk it getting checked around? Another reason not to slowplay. Now you are taking a chance of betting and having the pot immediately raised, forcing everyone else to call 2 bets cold drawing dead. If you raise the flop, even if you cap the flop, a bet out on the turn by you may just get called by MP3 and may get called by players willing to put in one more big bet to get lucky but not 2. And even if everyone still folds and MP3 only calls, you still got everyone's money in the pot on the flop.

River is fine.

CMangano · #6 02-11-2004, 12:38 AM

I disagree with leading into the raiser. The last thing I want to do here is bet and have the raiser raise and knock out players. He was in a perfect position to check-raise, however, since no one folded after MP3 bet, meaning they would probably call even if MP3 made it 3 bets.

me454555 · #7 02-11-2004, 02:34 AM

Betting the flop is a viable option, but I think given the action p/f a slowplay is fine here w/the stone cold nuts.

You can reasonbaly expect mp3 or button to bet behind you on the flop. I think the biggest mistake here is to bet out on the turn. MP3's limp reraise signals a big hand most likely AA or KK. I think he would be likely to bet out again on the turn. Given you position relative to MP3, I think a turn c/r would be much better and trap more people than simply betting out.

By betting out on the turn, although you ensure action, you also give MP3 behind you a chance to raise and thin the field considerably. A c/r, although isolating mp2, would trap most players for 2 BBs on the turn.

siccjay · #8 02-11-2004, 04:15 AM

I caught Quads on Party two days in a row and both times had an opponent cap the river....what a feeling [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

chesspain · #9 02-11-2004, 08:57 AM

Opponent showed 9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], and of course MHIG.

Thanks to all of you who've responded to this thread. I still think that checkcalling (rather than checkraising) the flop may have been correct, since it helped to disguise my hand, especially given all of the callers before me.

However, it was ridiculous for me to bet out on the turn. In essense, I was so excited about having five "live" ones come along to the turn on this somewhat coordinated, paired board that I did not even stop to think about the possibility that MP3 might raise my bet and force out everyone else. I had just assumed that he would call behind me and allow everyone else to call, even though raising for him for the proper play. Although it is entirely possible that MP3 would have dialed down the aggression if there had been a couple of turn callers after him, followed by my checkraise, I still imagine that my failure to use a little common sense here probably cost me at least a few big bets overall.

Zetack · #10 02-11-2004, 09:07 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Opponent showed 9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], and of course MHIG.

Thanks to all of you who've responded to this thread. I still think that checkcalling (rather than checkraising) the flop may have been correct, since it helped to disguise my hand, especially given all of the callers before me.

However, it was ridiculous for me to bet out on the turn. In essense, I was so excited about having five "live" ones come along to the turn on this somewhat coordinated, paired board that I did not even stop to think about the possibility that MP3 might raise my bet and force out everyone else. I had just assumed that he would call behind me and allow everyone else to call, even though raising for him for the proper play. Although it is entirely possible that MP3 would have dialed down the aggression if there had been a couple of turn callers after him, followed by my checkraise, I still imagine that my failure to use a little common sense here probably cost me at least a few big bets overall.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well you just stole my comments, lol. Yeah, just check call the flop. You've got most of your opponents trapped for a raise but you want to trap them on the turn for extra big bets instead of the flop. And then you have to check the turn. You want to maximize the size of this pot and that gives you the best shot I think.

--Zetack