Winning at microlevels - but at what level will it get tough?

PocketPaul · #1 10-17-2003, 08:36 AM

Hi everyone

1st time poster here who is very slowly working up the micro-limit levels.

I started playing online poker (Texas Hold'em) a couple of years ago on the play money tables at Pokeroom and found that winning was easy. Well no one really takes play money seriously (flop % = 90% with me being the 10% folding). I knew I was a beginner and wanted to improve so I invested in the usual recommended books and also started reading the 2+2 forums. These forums are excellent and have greatly improved my play, helping me become tighter and more aggressive.

About 6 months ago I decided to take the plunge and start playing for real money. The only problem was I had no spare cash, so I had to start my bankroll with a measly $10. I chose Planet Poker to commence playing for real as they have a good range of micro level games. So with $10 + $5 bonus I sat down to the $0.02 - $0.04 tables. To my surprise I found that winning was nearly as easy as it had been at the play money tables. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I follow the recommended BB requirement and do not move up in stakes until I reach 300BB at the new higher level. Progress is slow but steady and I have moved up through the $0.05 - $0.1 tables to the $0.1 - $0.25 tables. My bankroll is currently around $102 and my average win rate is around 3BB per hour. I have to say that the skill level at the $0.1 $0.25 tables is no higher than at the $0.02 - $0.04 tables, but maybe that is because I am improving all the time and am now more observant about other players mistakes. I find that most players are way too loose and mainly calling stations with some maniacs.

When my bankroll reaches $300, I intend to switch to Party Poker and commence playing at the $0.5 - $1 table. My main question I want to ask is how will the skill levels at the Party Poker tables compare to the micro limit tables I am playing at Planet Poker. Also at what level am I likely to find that I am no longer able to win? Is there any stake were suddenly the game gets much tougher? I am hoping that I will eventually be able to win at $3 - $6 but I guess that is a long time in the future.

I intend to make some postings in the small stakes forum, particularly on hands that I think I screwed up. I always find the advice is excellent.

I look forward to hearing your views on the skill levels at the lower lever Party Poker games and how far you think I may be able to progress.

Regards
Paul

Sooga · #2 10-17-2003, 10:28 AM

I think you'll find that at Party Poker you'll have to go up to about 5/10 and up in order to consistently be at tables that have players with a clue what is going on. However, everyone knows nowadays that all the fish are at Party, so the 3/6 games are a bit tougher than they used to be, but still ultimately beatable. As long as you keep playing and learning and have an adequate bankroll, there is no limit to how high you can progress.

Paluka · #3 10-17-2003, 10:37 AM

I think at limits this low 300bb is not required if you are a halfway decent player. You have already done way more homework than the other .50-1.00 players. I would suggest moving up sooner. You should consider scraping together some more cash just for buyin bonus reasons, even if you don't consider it part of your real bankroll.

cjx · #4 10-17-2003, 01:28 PM

Just keep doing what you are doing. If you do find a level that you begin to struggle with you might want to begin to examine your table/site selection more carefully or even move back down in limits. As long as you continue to strive to learn and improve I don't know that you have anything to worry about. As another poster mentioned you might be able to play and win at 3/6 right now, but I'd stick with your current plan.

So, uh, I don't have an answer to your question at all, but it sounds like you are doing great and I don't have any suggestions other than keep doing what you're doing (winning consistently).

cjx

squiffy · #5 10-17-2003, 01:36 PM

$100 is plenty of money at a party .50-$1 Table, as long as you are playing tight. I am a break-even to small profit player at .50-$1, $1-$2 and $2-$4. Think $1-$2 is much more aggressive than .50-$1, but that is just a general sense and I have no firm evidence of that.

At .50-$1, my maximum bankroll swings are from $20-$50, not large. Typically, though it is more like $10-$20 normally.

At $1-$2 my bankroll swings in winning and losing sessions are sometimes as large as $50-$100, but more typically will run from $25 to $50, positive or negative.

I am a solid tight player. Aggressive, but probably not aggressive enough. So I am probably not maximizing wins on my good hands. And I am probably chasing a bit too much with my marginal hands.

If you want to play it safe, build up to $200, then try Party. If you want to be SUPER SUPER SAFE, wait until you have $300. But if you have confidence in your game and want to take a shot at moving up, $100 is fine.

But Party does move pretty fast compared to say Pacific Poker. So I am not sure what site you are accustomed to. But that may be a bit of an adjustment. But there are plenty of good, bad, and indifferent players at .50-$1 on Party.

ElSapo · #6 10-17-2003, 02:46 PM

You'd be fine making the move to Party now. Begin playing .5/1, because of bankroll considerations, but I don't think it varies drastically from 1/2. The games changes a but to 2/4 and becomes more agressive at 3/6 (with a range from tight and agressive to loose agressive here). Party .5/1 is a good place to start -- many people on this board began there and are now playing much higher.

lefty rosen · #7 10-17-2003, 05:50 PM

If you look long and hard enough even the 15/30 tables at party are beatable if you have the roll to sustain idiotic drawouts. On Friday and Saturday nights mnay of these tables are a joke.......

jbc · #8 10-17-2003, 03:47 PM

Paul,

I basically have the same story as you, except I have been primarily a B&M HE player at whatever the lowest stakes were, winning most of the time. I didn't know much about poker theory, just a decent math guy and played the odds.

I went to online poker the same way you did, read all the good books and played for play money (mostly tourneys on pokerroom.com). All this got me to the point where I think about poker a lot even when I'm not playing (I know, I'm a loser w/ no life), so I decided to try real $ online since I am not close to a card room.

I got a bonus at work, so I dumped $300 into party poker with the 300 BB guideline you talked about, and tried .5/1. This is probably not news to anyone familiar with this limit at PP, but this game is kind of a joke for folks who have read the books (TOP, WLLHE, HFAP, etc.) and are familiar with decent starting standards and 'selective but aggressive' play. Probably describes most of the folk reading this forum. Of course tables will vary, but they are generally loose/passive.

I got semi lucky and have never actually gone negative into my bankroll. I still remember my first ever PP hand:

Posted BB in MP to get into the game, dealt 6T of diamonds. Saw the flop for free and flopped a Q high diamond flush. Ended up winning a decent size pot, and it has generally been smooth sailing since that hand.

I have not moved up levels yet, though I guess I technically can if you consider the 300BB guideline. Anyhoo, keep up the fight and work up your bankroll, I think you will gain a lot of confidence from doing this.

Good Luck,
jbc

PocketPaul · #9 10-19-2003, 05:32 AM

Thanks for the responses

You have reassured me that I should be able to win at the lower level Party Poker tables. I think I will wait until I get my bankroll to $200 and then make the move to the PP $0.5 - $1 tables.

See you at the tables soon.