I WANNA MAKE A PROFIT!!!!!!!!!

prolisa1000 · #1 10-12-2003, 07:19 PM

I love poker!! I have played online for free for a about a month now and have read both Hellmuth's and John Feeny's books on poker play, i am now playing for real money and everytime i make money i loose that money, i end up even. It frustrates me. I play very tight--only top 10 pair, sometimes a pair if it lands on the flop, and some Ax if it lands on the flop. Im afraid to raise even in a good position cause i wanna be 95% sure i will win when i do raise. I think this is my downfall i think, i just dont wanna go broke. what should i do??

Kurn, son of Mogh · #2 10-12-2003, 07:39 PM

Read something other than Hellmuth's book. His advice is horrible.

BruceZ · #3 10-12-2003, 09:03 PM

I believe the poster is a no-limit and pot-limit player, and the Hellmuth advice may be less horrible for those games, though I haven't read it.

crockpot · #4 10-12-2003, 10:56 PM

[ QUOTE ]
the Hellmuth advice may be less horrible for those games

[/ QUOTE ]
well, if "always go all in preflop with JJ" is better to you...

crockpot · #5 10-12-2003, 10:58 PM

here is my 4-step program to success:

1. pick up hellmuth's book
2. pour lighter fluid on book
3. light match and drop it on book
4. go pick up winning low limit hold 'em and the theory of poker and reread each until you've absorbed them. then start at small stakes and move up as you win money.

crackzone · #6 10-13-2003, 11:46 AM

Hm...i agree... Begin with the theory of Poker, then move up to hold em for advanced players...maybe something by caro after that?? or what do u guys think?
But i just wonder...how does hellmuth write a bad book on poker? did this cross your minds? doesn't he have any credit for his work? haven't read him, so i don't know.. but why is it bad? and if so, why did HE write it?

prolisa1000 · #7 10-13-2003, 12:10 PM

haha,

Your right, he did say that beginners should go all in with AA, KK..etc, but that piece of info i throw right out the window, i have had KK about 5 times and let me tell u, i only won one time with it. Had i done what he said i would have been broke a long time ago.
I do, however like what he says about suited connectors, and how NOT to play them very often, becuase more often than not they will not win. He says never play suite connectors less than 7-8, and i take that advice, Heck i dont even play AQ off, or AJ off, maybe i should fix my game, i just started playin AK off and i dont think i have won yet with it. Maybe i will raise with it the next time.

THANKS FOR UR COMMENTS, KEEP EM COMMING...........

crockpot · #8 10-13-2003, 02:40 PM

i think if you read these forums enough, you will find that no one respects hellmuth's play in any cash game. either he just plays that way because the money doesn't mean anything to him, or he's used to bullying people the way you have to in tournaments and has discovered that you can't do it in sidegames.

i think when phil wrote the book he set out to provide a shotgun method to learning poker. and to be fair, reading phil's top ten strategy won't make you a winner, but it will give you a better chance to have a winning session than picking up any other book for five minutes.

see if you can get as far as "phil's strategy - reraise with nothing". that describes how he plays on UB at all games from NL .10/.25 to $80/$160.

onegymrat · #9 10-13-2003, 03:50 PM

Prolisa,

I'm not sure when you say that you're afraid to raise, is it preflop or postflop? There are certain number of hands that you definitely should raise preflop, some in any position, some in certain positions. I'm sure all the poker authors will agree on most of the hands in question.

As far as postflop play, it's going to take experience and hours. It's very hard to pinpoint what hands you flop that you should raise with and general stuff like that. One advice I have is to pay attention to what wins and what doesn't, keep that in your mind so that the next time you have that hand, you'll know what to do. One thing I'm certain of. If you're afraid to raise in the course of a hand, two things are happening: you are leaving profit on the table on the hands you win (which is almost the same as losing) and the hands you are not driving out behind you with a raise are beating you in the end (which also mean you are losing).

Poker is a game of uncertainty and incomplete information. If we had all the answers, we would win every session. But since we don't, we go by experience and statistics. You WILL lose some hands you have raised, but if you are raising with the right hands and at the right time, in the long run, you will profit so much more. Hope this helps. Good luck.

AliasMrJones · #10 10-13-2003, 05:20 PM

Hellmuth's book was the first one I bought based on a quick flip of it and a couple of others at the bookstore. It covers multiple poker games and is quite thick compared to other books, plus has lots of nice quotes from well known poker players on the cover talking about how good Phil and his book are.

The book does introduce the concept of playing tight (Phil's top 10 hands) which is ok, but it is VERY light on any practical advice. It seems to be meant for beginners, but doesn't follow through with any real meat for any of its topics. So, you end up with something written for beginners, but with just enough info to get someone who doesn't understand the game into trouble. It mentions things like pot odds, but doesn't go into how the heck to make use of such a thing while playing. It says things like after a while with better position you can start playing A-x suited, without really going into detail about when and how to play it, but does say to make it 2 bets to go. It says to raise with medium pairs and then represent whatever hits on the flop. Huh? In any of the low limit online games I've played, this will get you killed. It talks to the reader as if the reader understands the game, but pretends to be a book for beginners so in the end there is nothing of interest for advanced players and not enough fundamentals to make it worthwhile for beginners. (In fact, as I said before it will probably cause problems for beginners trying to make use of the little info there is.)

I started playing $.25/$50 on UB after reading Hellmuth's book and broke even or was slightly profitable. After reading Jones' book I started beating the low-limit UB and have since read Sklansky and am now beating Party $2/4.

I haven't really picked up Hellmuth's book since moving on to the much better books so the above is what I remember from reading it.

My advice would be to pick up Jones' Winning Low Limit Hold 'Em and study it and play it for a while at $.25/50 or if on Party at $.50/1. After you're beating these games, get Hold 'Em For Advanced Players by S & M and start to move up in limits. I actually bought Sklansky's Hold 'Em Poker with Jones' book, but found Jones to lay out how to play low limit online poker in an easy to understand and put to use way. (His book isn't written specifically for online poker, but I found it fit low limit UB and Party perfectly.) Also, I found the best way to digest poker books is to read all the way through once, then go back through a section at a time. Pick a section and read it, then try to put it into practice, then read another section, etc. Then re-read a section and play, etc. I probably went through WLLHE at least 3 times this way. I'm continuing to re-read and work through HEFAP the same way.

These are all the ramblings of a relative newbie, so take it with a grain of salt. But I've been happy with where it has gotten me so far.