AJ. Folded set. Correct move?

#1 12-02-2005, 08:35 AM

CO: 17,6/7,2 over 453 hands
UTG+1: 18,8/8,6 over 499 hands
MP2: 25,3/7 over 1494 hands
MP3: 16,6/6,3 over 499 hands

Party Poker 0.50/1.00 Hold'em (10 handed) link

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
1 folds, UTG+1 calls, Hero calls, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, CO raises, 3 folds, UTG+1 calls, Hero calls, MP2 calls, MP3 calls.

Ok, I have no idea why I didn't raise it here. I know I should. Ah well...

Flop: (11.50 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero bets, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO calls, UTG+1 raises, Hero calls, MP3 calls, CO calls.

Gotta raise it here. UTG+1 check raises me,,, hmm? Ok I call and think over it again on the turn.

Turn: (9.75 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
UTG+1 bets, Hero calls, MP3 raises, CO calls, UTG+1 3-bets, Hero folds, MP3 calls, CO calls.

Ok he bets out now. He feels strong but since he just limped, could it be A9, A8, A7 or A6s? Or maybe even 22? I should either fold or raise to his bet here but I cold call, lucky me MP3 raise and UTG immediately 3-bet. Easy fold.

So in short, raise preflop and raise turn to get more info. Anything else? [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

#2 12-02-2005, 09:14 AM

Your lack of aggression allowed another to take control of the hand. If you had raised preflop and 3 bet the flop and STILL got 3 bet on the turn then I think it’s a lot easier to release you hand.

Koss · #3 12-02-2005, 09:33 AM

Wow, you played this hand pretty poorly IMO. First off this has to be a preflop raise. Easy flop 3-bet too.

Still, with that turn action, you're running out of aces in the deck for these guys to have, and it's likely one of them has the other ace, maybe full, and the other likely has either 22 or TT, so your fold is probably correct as long as neither of these guys get out of line ever.

hobbsmann · #4 12-02-2005, 09:51 AM

I'm sorry, but this hand sucks. Like you said raise preflop. The flop play is fine if your plan was to wake back up on the turn. You really should have put in more bets on the flop or raised the bet from UTG1 on turn. When MP3 comes alive all of sudden there is a chance your hand is no longer good, but considering you are beating all other reasonable aces AND (this is important) you still have odds to draw to a better full house if you are indeed behind, you shouldn't have folded where you did. Folding where you did is very clearly -EV.

#5 12-02-2005, 10:14 AM

I would try to get the pot biggest possible and go all the way to showdown with it. I would'nt fear somebody had 22, AQ, AK at the flop. At the turn i would'nt fear TT, AT, four flush or a gutshot. Or I'm I totally fishy wrong?

sean c · #6 12-02-2005, 10:15 AM

Hi Heaven the fold on the turn is bad you have full house outs.

#7 12-02-2005, 10:29 AM

if you think your behind the fold is probably correct. you are getting 10:1 on the turn cold call (if mp3 and CO both call)

However, I cant really see what you need to think over on the turn card? So rather than waiting for the turn to raise (which you didnt do anyway...), why not toss your money in pot already on the flop?

L

#8 12-02-2005, 10:29 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Hi Heaven the fold on the turn is bad you have full house outs.

[/ QUOTE ]

By the time it's hero's turn to play it's 15 big bets so he's getting 7.5:1 to call his 3 outer. If we assume he's behind a full house then he hasn't got odds to call. There's also an extra risk of it being capped.
I do agree that the way the hand was played we can’t assume we’re behind so I guess calling has it’s merits.
If we’d raised preflop and 3 bet the flop, raised the turn and STILL have it 2 bets back to us then…. Hmm I was about to say we don’t have odds to draw to full house, but the pot is so huge by then that we actually do. I check/fold the river UI though (unless we are last to act and it’s only 1 bet back to us).

Anyway just pointing out that we don’t have pot odds to draw to Fullhouse the way it was played

car ramrod · #9 12-02-2005, 10:44 AM

you have trips, not a set.

And I agree with everyone else, this hand was played poorly

sean c · #10 12-02-2005, 10:45 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hi Heaven the fold on the turn is bad you have full house outs.

[/ QUOTE ]

By the time it's hero's turn to play it's 15 big bets so he's getting 7.5:1 to call his 3 outer. If we assume he's behind a full house then he hasn't got odds to call. There's also an extra risk of it being capped.
I do agree that the way the hand was played we can’t assume we’re behind so I guess calling has it’s merits.
If we’d raised preflop and 3 bet the flop, raised the turn and STILL have it 2 bets back to us then…. Hmm I was about to say we don’t have odds to draw to full house, but the pot is so huge by then that we actually do. I check/fold the river UI though (unless we are last to act and it’s only 1 bet back to us).

Anyway just pointing out that we don’t have pot odds to draw to Fullhouse the way it was played

[/ QUOTE ]

Hi Newby re count the pot and re count the outs.