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#1
08-30-2005, 12:00 PM
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1/2 6max - 2nd pair TK on a paired flop
After about 10K of treading water on 1/2 6max and getting slapped around by Entity last weekend, I've decided to put my training wheels back on and try to work harder on reviewing my hands. Here's one hand that I didn't feel sure about.
This hand occured on my first orbit, had just posted on the BB a few hands ago. Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em Converted w/ PonksSaver: http://www.pokermentor.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=510 - - - HAND 2621062386 - - - PreFlop: <font color="blue">hero</font> is UTG+1 with <font color="red">A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]</font> <font color="red">8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]</font> (6 Players) 1 <font color="darkred">fold</font>, <font color="blue">hero</font> <font color="darkgreen">raises</font>, CO <font color="darkgreen">raises</font>, 1 <font color="darkred">fold</font>, SB calls, 1 <font color="darkred">fold</font>, <font color="blue">hero</font> calls, Flop: (10.00 SB) <font color="blue">8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]</font> <font color="red">9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]</font> <font color="green">9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]</font> (3 Players) SB checks, <font color="blue">hero</font> checks, CO <font color="green">bets</font>, SB calls, <font color="blue">hero</font> calls, This is my first question. Should I have called or checkraised? I feel like I have a good enough hand to play here. With the villain's pf 3-bet, I put him on high cards or a pocket pair. Maybe his reaction to a check raise would have helped me narrow that down? Turn: (6.50 BB) <font color="black">T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]</font> (3 Players) SB checks, <font color="blue">hero</font> checks, CO <font color="green">bets</font>, SB calls, <font color="blue">hero</font> calls, Same question as for the flop. At this point I'm starting to feel like a calling station. River: (9.50 BB) <font color="green">4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]</font> (3 Players) SB checks, <font color="blue">hero</font> <font color="green">bets</font>.... Nothing came down on the river that could have helped the villian out. Should I wait for him to bluff at the pot with overcards and call or make a donk bet? 
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#2
08-30-2005, 12:07 PM
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Re: 1/2 6max - 2nd pair TK on a paired flop
i would have donked the flop, hope CO raises SB out, and called down barring any scary OCs.
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#3
08-30-2005, 12:15 PM
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Re: 1/2 6max - 2nd pair TK on a paired flop
I like to play a paired flop fast if I've made 2 pair with the odd board card, especially when the the board is connected. Here I think it's good to lead the flop rather than try for the check-raise. There are a lot more ways you're ahead right now than behind, and I would hate for it to get checked through if CO doesn't bet his overcards.
On the river, I think I like check/call rather than betting. I don't think you're getting called with a worse hand that 3-bet preflop, whereas he might fire again at you with a big ace.
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#4
08-30-2005, 12:17 PM
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Re: 1/2 6max - 2nd pair TK on a paired flop
[ QUOTE ]
i would have donked the flop, hope CO raises SB out, and called down barring any scary OCs. [/ QUOTE ] This is something I've been thinking about alot lately, and a good example for discussing this play. I try to do this all the time, but how often does the CO have to have a worse hand when he raises for it to be profitable? I'm getting the growing impression that a raise means we're beat too often for this to be a 'standard' play without a laggy read.
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#6
08-30-2005, 12:19 PM
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Re: 1/2 6max - 2nd pair TK on a paired flop
[ QUOTE ]
i would have donked the flop, hope CO raises SB out, and called down barring any scary OCs. [/ QUOTE ] Let's say CO raises, SB folds, and you call. What's your plan if an ace falls on the turn? How about a king?
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#7
08-30-2005, 12:25 PM
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Re: 1/2 6max - 2nd pair TK on a paired flop
[ QUOTE ]
I'm not a big fan of the preflop raise, but the flop is an autobet [/ QUOTE ] 6-max I'd autoraise this preflop.
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#9
08-30-2005, 12:28 PM
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Re: 1/2 6max - 2nd pair TK on a paired flop
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] i would have donked the flop, hope CO raises SB out, and called down barring any scary OCs. [/ QUOTE ] This is something I've been thinking about alot lately, and a good example for discussing this play. I try to do this all the time, but how often does the CO have to have a worse hand when he raises for it to be profitable? I'm getting the growing impression that a raise means we're beat too often for this to be a 'standard' play without a laggy read. [/ QUOTE ] In this case, I think that a raise means we're likely behind to a big PP, giving us enough outs to call the raise and re-evaluate on the turn. Assuming that the CO has reasonable pf-3betting standards (for 6 max), how often would you think he'd raise with just overcards here? FWIW, I used to give it a higher likelihood than I do now, and would give him credit for an overpair until proven otherwise (i.e., I was paying off too much against unknowns). There have been a couple threads where people have given their different lines for WA/WB and HU in general. Playing a paired flop is probably another good candidate for a list of plays.
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#10
08-30-2005, 12:30 PM
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Re: 1/2 6max - 2nd pair TK on a paired flop
[ QUOTE ]
This is something I've been thinking about alot lately, and a good example for discussing this play. I try to do this all the time, but how often does the CO have to have a worse hand when he raises for it to be profitable? I'm getting the growing impression that a raise means we're beat too often for this to be a 'standard' play without a laggy read. [/ QUOTE ] I've been wondering about this as well. What about check/calling the flop and leading the turn? Easy fold to a raise.
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