25/50 hand reading post esp. for those in Keres thread

[Ulysses]

A number of people analyzed the Mahatma QJ hand in a way that I felt vastly oversimplified the situation. Here's a hand for you to analyze that might turn out to be an interesting exercise. Or not.

Answer the following questions:

1) What range of hands do you put my opponent on (on each street)?
2) What range of hands do you put me on (on each street)?
3) What is the worst hand you'll call the river with if you're me?

Provide any comments re: what you think might be going on in our heads.

3-handed. Folded to SB, very aggressive, decent player. He (5700) makes it 150 (standard pot open). I (cover) call in BB.

Flop Jc 9s 7d

He bets pot (300). I call.

Turn (Jc 9s 7d) Ah

He bets a little under pot (775). I call.

River (Jc 9s 7d Ah) Ts

He bets pot (2450).

[KaneKungFu123]

"I did not respond to this thread because I would have no idea what to do without knowing what gear Hat is in, what he thinks of Hero, whether Hero gets run over or makes bad calls, what has gone on in the last orbit/hour/day, and a multitude of other factors. One thing is for sure, there are definitely many situations when this is an insta-call for me vs. Mahatma. There are other situations in which I could fold this against him. Rhythm of the betting line is another factor worth taking into consideration here, at least to some degree."

[KaneKungFu123]

you, gab, and flynn outta put together/find a database of his hands, 300k hands or so, study his patterns and take his entire bankroll.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
you, gab, and flynn outta put together/find a database of his hands, 300k hands or so, study his patterns and take his entire bankroll.

[/ QUOTE ]

IMO, a large part of the reason Pra is so good is that he consciously and actively changes his patterns/lines/frequencies better than anyone else.

[BobboFitos]

[ QUOTE ]
"I did not respond to this thread because I would have no idea what to do without knowing what gear Hat is in, what he thinks of Hero, whether Hero gets run over or makes bad calls, what has gone on in the last orbit/hour/day, and a multitude of other factors. One thing is for sure, there are definitely many situations when this is an insta-call for me vs. Mahatma. There are other situations in which I could fold this against him. Rhythm of the betting line is another factor worth taking into consideration here, at least to some degree."

[/ QUOTE ]

pwned!

[edge]

Preflop and on the flop you can both have absolutely any hand. On the turn, his range is still any hand, but yours is probably a pair or better, although you could still be holding any hand if you plan on making a move on the river. On the river, I'd probably call with a J or better. Maybe a T.

Of course, the entire hand is affected by what you've been doing over the whole session and recent hands. In a vaccuum, both players can be holding pretty much any two cards, and the river decision is totally based on previous hands. If you're both good, aggressive players, you can easily call with air to make a move later. I don't think anything can really be said about this hand with no mention of both players' images and the way the last few orbits have gone.

[KaneKungFu123]

[ QUOTE ]

On the river, I'd probably call with a J or better. Maybe a T.


[/ QUOTE ]

those are some loose standards.

[shaniac]

Are you trying to indicate that there's a similar lack of information in this hand to the "50/100 Mahatma" hand?

Because that one involved a well-known opponent, a tricky board, a powerful hand and many (superficially, at least) analyzable aspects.

Your post reminds me of a creative-writing assignment--you gave us the characters and the scenery and want us to write a short story. Which is a cool idea, and if I wasn't so tired I might give it a shot. But I'm hard pressed to understand who besides you can offer tangible insight into this hand.

[bkholdem]

[ QUOTE ]
Are you trying to indicate that there's a similar lack of information in this hand to the "50/100 Mahatma" hand?

Because that one involved a well-known opponent, a tricky board, a powerful hand and many (superficially, at least) analyzable aspects.

Your post reminds me of a creative-writing assignment--you gave us the characters and the scenery and want us to write a short story. Which is a cool idea, and if I wasn't so tired I might give it a shot. But I'm hard pressed to understand who besides you can offer tangible insight into this hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, and it the other thread it's easy to assume that 'hero' lost or he wouldn't post. One is also able to assume that he probably didn't fold to the river push since he hit his money card and Mahatma isn't exactly the tightest player out there or the most passive player on the river. So one can draw the conclusion Mahatma had a set or better and won the hand. The action wasn't exactly heavy preflop or on the flop so that decreases the likelyhood of a pocket pair. All that has to be done is to backwards think: What does Mahatma have that beats top two in this scenario (since the hand was posted here)? Now no one wants to play diagnose the hand....

I'll bite.

SB has J 10