OTB with overdefensive blinds

[jason_t]

Both blinds defend too much.

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: I am Button with T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, I call....

Cool?

[Trix]

Valueraise !

[Haupt_234]

Still a raise or fold situation IMO. The hand isn't that strong and isn't worth a limp in a 2-3 way pot, even if you do have position.

Haupt_234

[Emmitt2222]

How much is too much? That makes a big differnece because even if they only fold every once and awhile its still worth it to raise, or if they give up on the flop easily. If they are super loose then Sklansky talks about limping here as being OK, but I would want those blinds to have vpips over 70 each and both be passive so I know they are not raising and this is a very rare occassion. So maybe this was one of those special times, but otherwise I don't like it.

[jason_t]

[ QUOTE ]
How much is too much? That makes a big differnece because even if they only fold every once and awhile its still worth it to raise, or if they give up on the flop easily. If they are super loose then Sklansky talks about limping here as being OK, but I would want those blinds to have vpips over 70 each and both be passive so I know they are not raising and this is a very rare occassion. So maybe this was one of those special times, but otherwise I don't like it.

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In about two hours of play, I hadn't seen either of them fold their blinds in a steal situation and were calling in many non-steal sitautions. Both have VPIPs &gt; 60 and both were passive.

Where does Sklansky talk about limping here being okay?

[wackjob]

I agree with above. Raise or fold, don't be a weak fish. Personally, I'd raise every time.

[spydog]

[ QUOTE ]
Both blinds defend too much.

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Fold.

[jason_t]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree with above. Raise or fold, don't be a weak fish. Personally, I'd raise every time.

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I don't think this is weak nor do I think it's fishy.

I do have a hand that will show a profit against these players; if I have an edge, it is small. Since I think they'll call a raise, by raising with little or no edge I just decrease my expectation by investing so much with a below average starting hand. By limping here, when I have a legitimate stealing hand later they may actually respect the attempt.

[jason_t]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Both blinds defend too much.

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Fold.

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You don't think this hand or others like it will show a profit in this situation?

[Emmitt2222]

QTip had some big thread on this awhile ago in SS, limping with a small pp on the button I believe against loose blinds. He quoted Sklansky or Mason as saying there are situations where this is applicable, or at least thats what I remember.