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  #1  
Old 02-13-2003, 02:42 PM
MMMMMM MMMMMM is offline
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Default Hanoi Chomsky

A revelatory speech, hitherto yet unknown, which Chomsky gave in North Vietnam in 1970. A direct look into his true feelings and loyalties.

http://www.frontpagemag.com/articles...le.asp?ID=6087

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  #2  
Old 02-13-2003, 02:47 PM
brad brad is offline
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Default Re: Hanoi Chomsky

funny i was just on frontpage.

david horowitz said peace protesters were 'fifth columnists' and a great danger to america.

somehow i doubt chomsky ever visited north vietnam but i am willing to believe it if you cite a more neutral source.
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Old 02-13-2003, 02:54 PM
MMMMMM MMMMMM is offline
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Default Re: Hanoi Chomsky

Why don't you investigate a little more before forming instant opinions?

In fact, while there are many sincere protesters amongst the anti-war movement today, much of its leadership has indeed been hijacked by ultra-radicals: Ramsey Clark, one major leader, serves as legal counsel for Saddam Hussein at present, and is leading a campaign to impeach Bush.

The VERBATIM transcript of Chomsky has been confirmed, and even loosely admitted to by Chomsky himself. This thread isn't about the anti-war movement--that's in other threads. Can you say "on-topic" please?
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Old 02-13-2003, 02:58 PM
brad brad is offline
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Default Re: Hanoi Chomsky

my point is that the author of your piece is on the record as calling peace protesters of today a 'fifth column'.

if you will provide another source for chomsky's visit to n.v. other than that article (and the book it references) then i will agree with you.

but just because some crazy right winger trashes chomsky thats not enough in itself to damn him.

also our president and staff were in business partnerships with saddam did u know that?
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Old 02-13-2003, 03:04 PM
MMMMMM MMMMMM is offline
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Default Re: Hanoi Chomsky

READ HIS OWN WORDS--that's what the thread's about--and more detail on verification, including Chomsky's own response--is available in Hanoi Chomsky II.

Get past the "source" block, brad, and I think there's hope for you yet (by the way, there IS a fifth column in the anti-war movement--along with lots of genuine folk hoping for peace--but that's another thread please).

Just because a "biased" site prints an article doesn't mean you can dismiss the facts in the article or the article itself wholesale--especially when the facts are subject to, and appear to have been, confirmed.
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Old 02-13-2003, 03:09 PM
brad brad is offline
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Default Re: Hanoi Chomsky

cant you provide even one more source (so far you have one, maybe two if you count the book but proably i think book shouldnt count as seperate one since its probably written by same group)?

is that too much to ask?

if i post a link to a site that says jews put blood in cakes and they quote a rabbi as saying its an ancient ritual 'in his own words', would u believe it?
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Old 02-13-2003, 03:13 PM
MMMMMM MMMMMM is offline
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Default Re: Hanoi Chomsky

Read the damn article--both of them--they GIVE outside confirming sources---that's what you want, right??? jeez--how can you be so thick...
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  #8  
Old 02-13-2003, 03:33 PM
brad brad is offline
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Default Re: Hanoi Chomsky

'I first came across a quote from this speech in the book "DESTRUCTIVE GENERATION: Second Thoughts About the Sixties", by Peter Collier & David Horowitz. I had '

ok thats his own book. i think youd agree that doesnt count as an additional source.

'so I kept looking. I found the primary source in the book "POLITICAL PILGRIMS: Western Intellectuals in Search of the Good Society", by Paul Hollander. Then '

ok maybe but like i said it could have been published by same guys.

'Then, with the irreplaceable help of Stephen Denney, an archivist with the UC Berkeley Indochina Center, I was able to obtain a transcript of the entire speech, which I have provided above.'

i looked on there but couldnt find it.

-----------------------

so as famous (or infamous) as chomsky is, those are the only sources in the entire world that chomsky even took a trip to n.v. during v. war?

to reiterate, this is the only time ive ever heard that chomsky traveled to n.v.

to me this level of documentation is not sufficient to support such a claim. it seems to me i would be able to find somewhere else the fact that a prominent anti war guy like chomsky visited north vietnam. (i mean i did search on google and stuff)
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  #9  
Old 02-13-2003, 03:36 PM
brad brad is offline
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Default Re: Hanoi Chomsky

http://www.frontpagemag.com/GoPostal...ommentID=59126

'Turning to your correspondent, he couldn't have cited what I said on
Hanoi
radio, because I never spoke on Hanoi radio. I did mention Le Duan in
print, once, in an article reprinted in _At War With Asia_, 1970, one of

two that described a visit to Laos and North Vietnam, where I was
immersed
in the atrocities that your correspondent so admires. You can read them'

well i dont know it looks like he did visit n.v. but denies the speech but this is predicated on this being an accurate transcript copied off zmag.

maybe ill go to zmag and look it up.
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  #10  
Old 02-13-2003, 03:44 PM
Chris Alger Chris Alger is offline
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Default Re: Hanoi Chomsky

Verbatim? Really? Radio Hanoi broadcast Chomsky in English although hardly anyone North Vietnam spoke English? Why then would the transcript (as opposed to translation) have come from the U.S. government? Is it inconceivable that the Hanoi government took certain liberties with the speech when it came to praising the Hanoi regime, which elsewhere Chomsky has criticized?

Chomsky's reply: "I know nothing of any speech broadcast on North Vietnamese radio 30 years ago, or ever." He admits that portions of the speech are similar to things he was writing at the time, but most of those that have read most of his work believe that it doesn't "sound" like what he usually says (it's too effusive, for one, and he's usually detached and sardonic; and he's a bitter foe of Marxism-Leninism and state or non-libertarian socialism).

http://www.isp.nwu.edu/~fprefect/politics/chomsky.html

So where has he "loosely admitted" it? Never mind. Let's just point out that in order to attack someone who's published hundreds of articles, speeches and books about US foreign policy, they have to hang their hat on an "official" transcription of a foreign speech given 30 years ago that no one can remember him giving. How very persuasive.
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