Turn Raise vs. River Raise

Wizard0965 · #1 06-26-2005, 04:23 PM

PokerStars 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 4 folds, Hero calls, 2 folds, BB checks.

Flop: (3.40 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB bets, UTG calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (3.20 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB bets, UTG calls, Hero calls.

River: (6.20 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets, BB calls, UTG folds.

Final Pot: 8.20 BB

So I could've raised the turn and gotten BB to follow with me but UTG would have folded. So I tried to just call down to the river and raise there hoping BB would continue to bet into me and UTG calling with top pair or such. Ideas?

silkyslim · #2 06-26-2005, 04:32 PM

Fold on the flop. "But then I wouldn't have got my straight" Too bad the pot is too small to continue, its tiny. After that, you have to raise the turn, you are last to act and everyone already called! You are almost guaranteed 2 more bets if you raise. Then lead the river when checked to

Greg J · #3 06-26-2005, 04:37 PM

I think you should consider a raise preflop, depending on my read on the open limper. Does he play a lot of crap preflop? If so, this is a clear raise. Does he generally play only strong hands from up front? If that is the case, then a fold might be in order. I generally don't like a call here.

As you played it, I don't think you are getting proper odds to call this flop. I will give you 1.5 outs for yr overcard, and 3 clean outs for yr straight. You need ~11:1 (round up since the J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] might still be a good out) to call, and are getting 4.2:1. I don't think the implied odds make this worth it the call. Fold.

On the turn you MUST raise this.

[brutal tough love honesty] Bottom line: misplayed on all streets aside from the river. [/brutal tough love honesty]

Vote4Pedro · #4 06-26-2005, 04:43 PM

I'm either raising or folding in this situation

cold_cash · #5 06-26-2005, 04:53 PM

UTG isn't going to fold if you raise the turn; If he does I'll eat my hat.

He's also not going to call on the river w/ a four-flush or a busted straight draw.

Raise him while he's drawing, not after he's missed.

Edit - And yes, the flop call is pretty bad, and I'm not crazy about your initial limp.

bozlax · #6 06-26-2005, 04:57 PM

Raise or fold preflop with good position. If you raise (which I'd do, dependent on my read of UTG and Button), you have to semi-bluff raise this flop as well.

Regardless of what action got you here, you need to raise this turn.

At least you got the river right.

bozlax · #7 06-26-2005, 05:03 PM

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. MP2 posts a blind of $0.5.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, 1 fold, MP2 (poster) checks, Hero raises, 3 folds, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP2 calls.

Flop: (8.50 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP2 bets, Hero raises, BB calls, UTG+1 folds, MP2 calls.

Turn: (7.25 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, MP2 checks, Hero bets, BB calls, MP2 calls.

River: (10.25 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, MP2 bets, Hero raises, BB folds, MP2 calls.

Final Pot: 14.25 BB

And no kittens were harmed in the playing of this hand.

Entity · #8 06-26-2005, 05:04 PM

Raise preflop, fold the flop, and raise the turn.

milesdyson · #9 06-26-2005, 05:14 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Raise or fold preflop with good position. If you raise (which I'd do, dependent on my read of UTG and Button), you have to semi-bluff raise this flop as well.

[/ QUOTE ]
if you raised preflop, no, you would not "have to semi-bluff raise" the flop.

lucid · #10 06-26-2005, 06:49 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Raise preflop, fold the flop, and raise the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Would you mind explaining why to raise pre-flop? Thanks

lucid