Please help the donkey

AASooted · #1 06-16-2005, 09:44 AM

I have a lot to learn, especially post-flop. Any comments would be greatly appreciated.

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
2 folds, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, 1 fold, CO calls, 1 fold, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (6 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG+2 checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, CO checks.

Should I have bet this to try to induce some folds? I'm pretty much lost with overcards.

Turn: (3 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (6 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG+2 checks, MP1 bets, MP2 folds, CO folds, Hero calls, BB folds, UTG+2 calls.

River: (6 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, UTG+2 folds, MP1 calls.

At this point, with so little betting, I'm thinking no one's matched the board and my kicker is good.

Final Pot: 8 BB

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
5 folds, Hero raises, CO calls, 2 folds, BB calls.

Flop: (6.50 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB bets, Hero calls, CO folds.

Looking at it now, I'm thinking I should have raised this to try to get rid of some draws. At the time, I was thinking I wanted to keep CO around to get more out of him on the turn and river.

Turn: (4.25 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero raises, BB calls.

River: (8.25 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB calls.

Final Pot: 10.25 BB

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
2 folds, Hero calls, 1 fold, CO raises, Button calls, 1 fold, BB calls, Hero calls.

I hate to see this raise with the small PP. Should have I folded at that point? I felt like the first call was borderline, but I did it since we were 8-handed.

Flop: (8.50 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, Hero checks, CO bets, Button folds, BB calls, Hero folds.

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
Hero calls, UTG+1 raises, 6 folds, Hero calls.

I normally wouldn't call UTG with this, but I loosened up a little since we were 8-handed.

Flop: (5.50 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets, Hero calls.

Turn: (3.75 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets, Hero folds.

Dealing with overcards again. Given the pre-flop raise, I figured I was beaten. I probably should have figure that out a little earlier.

Final Pot: 4.75 BB

I hope this isn't too many hands to include in one post. As I said, I still have a lot of learning to do. I've been through SSH once, but much of it hasn't stuck yet. That's a lot of information to use to make a decision in less than a minute.

Thanks for any feedback.

DeathDonkey · #2 06-16-2005, 09:51 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Please help the donkey

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm fine, thanks.

-DeathDonkey

ps: Hand 1: I raise preflop. The way you played it fold to the turn bet.

Hand 2: Raise the flop and just go from there. You played this one backwards.

Hand 3: Perfect.

Hand 4: If you play this you should raise preflop but you should really just fold this preflop. Fold the flop since you got there.

sirana · #3 06-16-2005, 09:59 AM

Carefull with this answer, it's more like the blind leading the blind ;-)

Hand 1: I'd bet the flop since it isn't too coordinated and the overcards are pretty strong. Since you didn't and the pot is really small I'd prob. fold the turn.

Hand 2: Yep, raise the flop. rest seems ok.

Hand 3: I think there are enough players to call preflop. folding the flop is right.

Hand 4: I would fold the flop, since u are HU and the pot is small.

atnels · #4 06-16-2005, 10:03 AM

I agree with DeathDonkey, with one additional comment. In Hand 3, you open limp with a low PP in MP. What I do here depends greatly on the texture of the table. I'm likely to either raise or fold, because limping invites somebody to steal-raise behind you.

Like what happened in your hand, you often wind up HU with a low PP if the table is on the tight side. Since by your own admission your post flop play isn't very strong yet, this kind of situation can be bad if you aren't sure when to release your hand, when to be agressive, or when to call down.

karitek · #5 06-16-2005, 10:19 AM

As far as overcards go, you need to just view them as a weak draw. count your outs (1.5 for each overcard and add in any BDFD or BDSD), and see if you have the odds to bet.

When you are betting overcards, you want a small field because against 6 players it's unlikely that top pair is going to win. You also want to get people out with your bet, so look at the board. If it's coordinated, it's more likely that someone hit it or is going to stay in on a draw.

In hand 1, you have 4.5 outs (2 overcards, and a BDFD). You need about 9:1 from the pot to justify betting, and you are only getting 6:1. It's an easy check/fold - especially into that many opponents with a slightly coordinated board. You should definitely fold that turn.

In hand 2, raise the flop. you most likely have the best hand.

In hand 3, I'm folding preflop before the raise even happens. Once 2 people have folded in front of me, I'm not sure that I am going to get enough people in the hand to warrant limping. Once you've limped, you have to call the raise.

Hand 4, fold the flop. It's a small pot, heads up, and you are most likely behind.

AASooted · #6 06-16-2005, 10:29 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Please help the donkey

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm fine, thanks.

-DeathDonkey

[/ QUOTE ]

Good to know. I'll stop worrying.

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 2: Raise the flop and just go from there. You played this one backwards.

[/ QUOTE ]

It felt backwards after I was done. I get a little excited and start feeling invincible when I pick up aces. I need to get over that and pay attention to what's going on.

Thanks for the input.

jrz1972 · #7 06-16-2005, 10:43 AM

Hand 1: Fold the turn. Its quite unlikely that your hand is good, and you don't have anywhere near the odds to draw.

Hand 2: Raise the flop to knock out the straggler. Bet the turn, bet the river.

Hand 3: Easiest fold ever on the flop.

Hand 4: Terrible limp PF. KJo sucks and you were rightly punished for limping with it OOP.

AASooted · #8 06-16-2005, 11:09 AM

[ QUOTE ]
As far as overcards go, you need to just view them as a weak draw. count your outs (1.5 for each overcard and add in any BDFD or BDSD), and see if you have the odds to bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess I'm just trying to make it too complicated. This I can handle.

[ QUOTE ]
When you are betting overcards, you want a small field because against 6 players it's unlikely that top pair is going to win.

[/ QUOTE ]

Makes sense. I need to be more aware of the number of players and the pot size.

Thanks for the pointers.

karitek · #9 06-16-2005, 11:12 AM

also, you might want to search the board for threads on overcards. there are loads of them, and examples help explain things way more than pointers do.

Aaron W. · #10 06-16-2005, 12:32 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
Hero calls, UTG+1 raises, 6 folds, Hero calls.

I normally wouldn't call UTG with this, but I loosened up a little since we were 8-handed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Beware! This is a *BAD* way of implementing that idea. Think of 8-handed as 10-handed with a couple folds in front of you. You shouldn't be open-limping KJo from that early position. If you play it, you've got to open-raise it, but folding is still better (with slightly better position, a raise becomes better).