JJ in EP - Draw heavy board. River Help?

AlphaMeridian · #1 06-04-2005, 03:14 PM

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, Hero raises, UTG+2 calls, 1 fold, MP2 calls, 2 folds, Button calls, 1 fold, BB calls.

Flop: (10.50 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, UTG+2 calls, MP2 calls, Button calls, BB calls.

Turn: (7.75 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, UTG+2 calls, MP2 calls, Button calls, BB calls.

River: (12.75 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, UTG+2 calls, MP2 raises, Button calls, BB calls, Hero folds, UTG+2 calls.

Final Pot: 21.75 BB

There are several things I want to ask about this hand, mainly in relation to SSH. First, I have an overpair in a huge pot here on the flop. However, every time I see posts about "waiting until the turn" to bet are usually met with "this wasn't the situation" or "you misapplied the concept". The table is EXTREMELY loose passive. (36% VPIP now, but that's after some of the donators have sat out for a bit)

Anyway, back to the hand. I assume the PFR is good. I'm not so sure about the rest of the streets. I bet out on the flop, but everyone definately has the odds to continue on the draw. The turn brings a moderately scary card. I bet out, and they all call. The river, OTOH, is where I might be the most confused. I bet out (which I think might have been a big mistake considering the 4 straight on the board) and I get raised. Then I'm debating calling one more in a gigantic pot. But I know that at LEAST one of the 4 people can be holding Ace-rag, not to mention I'm behind to the sixes as well. Had it been less people, is this an easy call? Is it an easy call even WITH that many people in on the river?

-Alpha

iNsChris · #2 06-04-2005, 03:24 PM

Check/Call the flop - I play it the same besides that.

May be "scared" but id rather checked around for freeshowdown than lose 2BB's to someone holding an Ax.

Firefly · #3 06-04-2005, 03:25 PM

PF- Standard
Flop- The pot is big and i highly doubt you can protect your hand at this point, so bet for value. You can't c/r becuase you have no clue who your going to c/r. Waiting for the turn and perhaps giving infinate odds sucks, so bet.
Turn- Same reasoning as above, pretty much. Your hand is still likely to be good. Bet for value
River- It's tough. I'd probally try to get to showdown, by check calling. Fold if two cold. Heck, the river confuses me too...

Bodhi · #4 06-04-2005, 03:26 PM

Waiting until the turn is for when the pot is much bigger than it was here.

You played this well.

Bodhi · #5 06-04-2005, 03:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Check/Call the flop - I play it the same besides that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Let's give infinite odds to someone on a draw?

Terrible, absolutely terrible.

afk · #6 06-04-2005, 03:39 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Check/Call the flop - I play it the same besides that.

May be "scared" but id rather checked around for freeshowdown than lose 2BB's to someone holding an Ax.

[/ QUOTE ]

Unlearn this very quickly. Checking this flop is pretty bad.

I think hero played this one fine. I'm not really sure there's any other way to play it.

aK13 · #7 06-04-2005, 04:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Check/Call the flop - I play it the same besides that.

May be "scared" but id rather checked around for freeshowdown than lose 2BB's to someone holding an Ax.

[/ QUOTE ]

Unlearn this very quickly. Checking this flop is pretty bad.

I think hero played this one fine. I'm not really sure there's any other way to play it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Check/calling flop is a disaster.

For the river, anybody check to see the action, then decide whether to call based on # of overcallers (seeing how many are possibly lurking around with A high?)

afk · #8 06-04-2005, 04:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Check/Call the flop - I play it the same besides that.

May be "scared" but id rather checked around for freeshowdown than lose 2BB's to someone holding an Ax.

[/ QUOTE ]

Unlearn this very quickly. Checking this flop is pretty bad.

I think hero played this one fine. I'm not really sure there's any other way to play it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Check/calling flop is a disaster.

For the river, anybody check to see the action, then decide whether to call based on # of overcallers (seeing how many are possibly lurking around with A high?)

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah you might be right there. Checking the river may be better since it's quite likely someone has made a straight. Perhaps check and call one but not two? Though I'd rather not be making the 2nd or 3rd overcall either.

benkath1 · #9 06-04-2005, 04:57 PM

If your going to bet the river, call for one more. I hate these hands, but I think you made money on all streets but the river.

I would check call the river hoping for the bluff.

benkath1 · #10 06-04-2005, 04:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Check/Call the flop

[/ QUOTE ]

U mean river, right??? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Like everyone else said, unlearn this.