Another KK hand from me...

moot · #1 06-02-2005, 02:18 AM

I swear, every time... ACE ACE ACE.

Preflop's a no brainer. On the flop I was kind of lost. Obviously I'm not folding with set and backdoor flush outs (plus there's a chance I might be ahead still). Should I have raised the flop? I really don't see what this accomplishes.

I checked the turn because I was almost ready to let this hand go. I wanted to see the action behind me. Is this way too weak?

I think next time, I'm raising the flop, seeing how many callers behind, and if I don't improve to a set of flush draw on the turn I'm going defensive and potentially looking for a chance to release this hand.

Your thoughts?

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. MP2 posts a blind of $0.5. CO posts a blind of $0.5.
UTG calls, Hero raises, UTG+2 calls, 1 fold, MP2 (poster) calls, MP3 calls, 1 fold, Button calls, BB calls, UTG calls, Hero 3-bets, UTG+2 calls, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, Button calls, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (29.50 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (8 players)
BB bets, UTG calls, Hero calls, UTG+2 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, Button calls.

Turn: (17.75 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (7 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero checks, MP2 checks, MP3 checks, Button checks.

River: (17.75 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (7 players)
BB checks, UTG folds, Hero checks, MP2 checks, MP3 checks, Button checks.

Final Pot: 17.75 BB

EDIT ==

I really REALLY think I should have raised the flop. It just makes the hand play a lot easier, IMO.

thesharpie · #2 06-02-2005, 02:24 AM

I don't raise the flop. Any ace will call even if they think they're behind, they're getting the right price on their 3 outer. I play this the same.

Edit: Nice table.

cold_cash · #3 06-02-2005, 02:34 AM

After I've 3-bet myself pre-flop I always follow through with the self-cap.

I don't mind calling the flop, but after the way the action went I would bet the turn.

I think the river might play differently had you bet the turn.

I can't really say I love your chances, even with the lack of action, but I'm going to find a way to show this down unless it really hits the fan on the river; the pot is just too big not to.

2+2 wannabe · #4 06-02-2005, 02:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I really REALLY think I should have raised the flop. It just makes the hand play a lot easier, IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]

true

you can't let everyone hang around in this hand - obviously if you get re-raised you know where you stand. i don't think this decision is close

p.s. how do you re-raise yourself pre-flop?

cold_cash · #5 06-02-2005, 02:51 AM

How does a flop raise make this easier to play?

The pot is already huge, you can't protect anything, and if you get 3-bet you can't fold.

Add to this the fact that if you do raise the flop and get 3-bet, the pot will probably be so big you'll have to call on the turn also.

SoftcoreRevolt · #6 06-02-2005, 03:00 AM

You would have to call the turn either way with how big the pot is, so why are we worried? Raise the flop, while the field is big, bad players play badly, and you'd be surprised how often you are ahead here.

bottomset · #7 06-02-2005, 03:00 AM

[ QUOTE ]
After I've 3-bet myself pre-flop I always follow through with the self-cap.

[/ QUOTE ]

Party added livestraddles?? thats got to liven up the 2+2 tables

cmwck · #8 06-02-2005, 03:07 AM

Raising the flop would be kind of ridiculous since the pot is so fricken' huge. What's going on preflop by the way? How'd you 3-bet yourself?

Betting the turn might make the river easier to play.

2+2 wannabe · #9 06-02-2005, 03:08 AM

[ QUOTE ]
You would have to call the turn either way with how big the pot is, so why are we worried? Raise the flop, while the field is big, bad players play badly, and you'd be surprised how often you are ahead here.

[/ QUOTE ]

exactly

you don't want people to catch raggedy 2 pair, chase sets, or catch their runner runner straights cheaply

cold_cash · #10 06-02-2005, 03:09 AM

[ QUOTE ]
You would have to call the turn either way with how big the pot is, so why are we worried?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is no reason to raise the flop.

I don't understand what it would accomplish. Is it to protect your hand?

Is it for value?

Against 6 opponents and an Ace high flop, with 4 of them left to act behind me, I'm not loving my KK.

What happens if you raise the flop and get 2 cold-callers along with the original bettor? What do you do on the turn?