Bellagio Ruling

Huskiez · #1 05-08-2005, 02:27 PM

I have a question about a ruling that was done a few weeks ago at the Bellagio.

I am playing NL. CO limps, SB calls, I raise pot, CO calls, SB folds.

Flop comes Kxx.

I am thinking about how much to bet, so I look down at my chips and think. After five seconds, I noticed that there's a turn card out there. What just happened?

Apparently the dealer thought that when I looked down I had checked. I may have brought my arm down but I definitely did not rap the table to check. She had motioned to CO what he wanted to do, and he checked. She turned the next card.

My friend in SB knew I had not checked and no one at the table had seen me check either.

They called the floor and said that the turn card stands and to play it from there as if I had checked.

I thought it would make more sense to shuffle the 3 back in the deck and let us play the flop. But I didn't get a chance to object because floor said her ruling was final after one second of deliberation.

Is this a standard ruling?

DrPublo · #2 05-08-2005, 02:35 PM

Are you sure you didn't rap the table? This has happened to me once or twice when I was thinking about how much to bet and inadvertently tapped the table.

The moral is be deliberate in your actions. You should have said something when the dealer moved the action to the CO.

The Doc

tylerdurden · #3 05-08-2005, 02:36 PM

You've got to protect your action. THe card is already out there, there's no way they're going to put it back in the deck and shuffle.

Huskiez · #4 05-08-2005, 02:39 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Are you sure you didn't rap the table?

[/ QUOTE ]

That's why I bolded it. I did not rap.

[ QUOTE ]
You should have said something when the dealer moved the action to the CO.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was looking at my chips figuring out how much to bet, so I did not notice.

Huskiez · #5 05-08-2005, 02:41 PM

[ QUOTE ]
THe card is already out there, there's no way they're going to put it back in the deck and shuffle.

[/ QUOTE ]

I remember playing at Harrah's and they were going to shuffle the card back in depending on what another person did during a floor ruling.

I forget the exact situation, but I am sure there are times shuffling back is warranted? Maybe they had an incorrect ruling at Harrah's though.

dansalmo · #6 05-08-2005, 03:08 PM

This is a standard ruling when they rule that you did check.

If they had ruled that you had not checked, they would have shuffled the card back into the deck and put up a new turn card.

FYI, You are responsible for not making any kind of indication that could be interpeted as action.

AngusThermopyle · #7 05-08-2005, 04:28 PM

[ QUOTE ]

If they had ruled that you had not checked, they would have shuffled the card back into the deck and put up a new turn card.

[/ QUOTE ]
No. Standard ruling for Burn and Turn the turn card too soon is:

1. Finish Flop action.
2. Place 'early Turn Card' off to side
3. Burn and put what would have been the River Card as the new Turn Card.
4. Turn betting action
5. Shuffle 'early Turn Card' with the remaining deck (not the muck or burns)
6. Cut, do not burn, place new River Card
7. River betting action

tarcards · #8 05-08-2005, 04:57 PM

This ruling is incorrect, the same thing happened to me at the bellagio a month ago, the dealer thought i said check instead of bet and delt the turn card. I asked for the floor because the dealer did not know what to do, i told him the the burn for the river should be taken along with placing the river face down and shuffling the turn card back into the deck and finish the action on the flop. The floor said that was exactly what he should do and i was allowed to bet.

youtalkfunny · #9 05-08-2005, 05:23 PM

The dealer taps the table before putting the next card out. This is her way of saying, "This is your last chance to stop me if you think I'm putting the next card out before the action is complete."

If you didn't notice this, nor the action of your opponent, you're not paying enough attention to what is going on. I realize your mind was focused on your next action, but you cannot ignore what is going on around you. Nor can you rely on the dealer to protect your action.

It's like a pitcher shaking off the sign from his catcher. He can't get so wrapped up in deciding on the next pitch that he ignores the baserunners.

God, what a horrible analogy.

Randy_Refeld · #10 05-08-2005, 07:38 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I may have brought my arm down but I definitely did not rap the table to check.

[/ QUOTE ]

Bring you arm down very well can be taken as a check. You have to realize that some players wiggle their pinky to indicate check. You have an obligation to protect your action. If you look at your chips and go into such deep thougth that you can't see what is going on around you should work on paying attention or possible move to a lower level. As another poster mentioned the reason the dealer taps the table before burning is to give the players a chance to stop him and tell him they haven't acted.