Randomize This!!

[Rainbow Warrior]

At B&M poker rooms we watch the deck get shuffled, cut and dealt. In flop games the deck is set in a certain order and the cards you see on board can not be altered. You can fold at any time, see what comes up and KNOW that you folded another winner. Naturally this is followed by the mandatory weeping, wailing and flailing.

In on-line poker we have no such visual proof. Does the deck, after it is virtually cut and dealt, remain in the same pre-set order or is there further randomizing (shuffling) of the remaining cards going on throughout the hand. At Paradise, where I play, they claim to virtually shuffle the freakin' pips off the cards using mega-bit seeds, multiple passes of Knuth's full shuffle algorithms (HUH??), added entropy (make mine a double), an overkill RNG based on the Berkeley prng using a state table size of 64 longs (that's nice), etc., etc. There is a further randomizing factor based on the entire mouse and keyboard movements of the known universe. Nowhere is it stated that what you see is what you would have got if you stayed in. I wonder if there is continuous shuffling going on throughout the hand.

Having folded a whatever-outer, then seeing one of them hit the board, I'm barely able to muster up a shrug. Not even an audible groan. No real emotion. I can't be sure it would have hit if I stayed in. My tilting skills that I've worked diligently to maintain are sadly waning. Flacid am I. I need to know. Can you help me?


http://www.paradisepoker.com/shuffling.html

[lorinda]

I have trawled through those pages on more than one occasion and I believe that the cards are shuffled prior to dealing and set.

However, you can console yourself when you fold your runner runner royal that I might be wrong on this one, because it is not clear that they are, just looks like it [img]/forums/images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

If you play video poker, the cards are usually dealt under the five originals, so unless you change the first card you can't use the "Damn, I would have hit the <insert appropriate big hand>" on that game.

Lori

To keep safe from raving insanity while playing a lot of flop poker I have developed the absolute nuts in board card theories. It relies on Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle which briefly stated sez that you can not measure or observe something without changing the object you are measuring. This was originally applied to sub-atomic particles but it works well in pokers too.

Here's how it works in poker. You are debating a call on the turn with a draw. There are two possible paths for the future, one where you fold and one where you call. There is no reason to believe that the river card is the same in both futures. Your call or fold changes all that follows. You can not fold and ever be sure to get the river card that follows since it comes only in the future where you fold.

Want more? Check into Shroedinger's (sp?) cat. You're welcome.

[lorinda]

Certainly in low limit poker, there are lots of constant planks.

[Jimbo]

Isn't that the theory that the cat will be both dead and alive at any moment in time? Only when you make the observation will it be one or the other. I believe Quantam physics explains your theroy Doug! I like It!! [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

[GrannyMae]

I believe Quantam physics explains your theroy Doug

quantam physics don't splain' crap. just gives me a headache and more questions.