I really should know what to do on this river...

chesspain · #1 04-17-2005, 04:20 PM

Online 4-8...I don't have a good read on the Hijack, but I assume he's pretty fishy given his coldcall. The Button is a fishy calling station. The BB is simply donkish, as I saw him checkraise a field with flopped trip nines (ace kicker), only to check the turn and the river despite there being no real str8 or flush threats, and no bet on the turn by anyone.

Chesspain raises UTG with K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4 folds, Hijack calls, 1 fold, Button calls, 1 fold, BB calls (four to the flop).

Flop (8.5 SB) A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
BB checks, Chesspain bets, Hijack calls, Button and BB fold.

Turn (10.5 SB) 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
Chesspain bets, Hijack calls.

River (6 BB) J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Chesspain...

a) Bets-Calls?
b) Bets-Folds?
c) Checks-Calls?
d) Checks-Folds?

ChromePony · #2 04-17-2005, 04:25 PM

This looks like a good time to check/call and perhaps inspire a bluff to me, Too weak?

edited for inability to read

chesspain · #3 04-17-2005, 04:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
This looks like a good time to check/call and perhaps inspire a bluff to me, then you can fold if it comes 2 back to you. Too weak?

[/ QUOTE ]

Since we are heads-up on the river...I assume you are referring to the flop?

Roland19 · #4 04-17-2005, 04:32 PM

I say a check call is in order here. I'm on a big kick of trying to induce crappy opponents to bluff on later streets, so I go ahead and give him the opportunity to do so. This way, it is cheap for you and you are committed to a showdown, plus you give him the opportunity to bluff at the pot.

ChromePony · #5 04-17-2005, 04:43 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Since we are heads-up on the river...I assume you are referring to the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

Somehow missed the heads up part, but I was talking about the river. No way are we check/calling this flop...

cold_cash · #6 04-17-2005, 04:51 PM

It's tough to narrow down his hand. Does he have a hand or a busted draw? Who knows?

Reasons I like betting:

- Hands like 99, TT, etc., will probably call a bet, though they probably won't bet themselves.

- You're planning on calling anyway if he bets.

- If you're raised it seems like a pretty straight-forward fold.

Reasons I like checking:

- Hands like QK, QT, etc., that missed the gutshot might make a stab at the pot.

I think I'm leaning toward betting. It seems to me that the majority of players we come up against will fall into the "call too much, but don't bet enough" category, as opposed to the "bluff too much" category. Since he's unknown I would assume he's in the former group until I find out otherwise.

CallMeIshmael · #7 04-17-2005, 05:00 PM

I lean towards betting here.

IMO, the whole 'let them bluff' tends to be over done at this limit.

He is likely to take a free showdown with the hands that beat us but with which he is willing to call (lower PPs), but will bet if he is beating us.

I dont think he bets KQ or the like often enough to making picking off a bluff better.

private joker · #8 04-17-2005, 05:04 PM

I like a check-call because I'm not comfortable folding to a river raise. The hand has showdown value, so bet/fold seems wrong, check/fold has to be wrong, but bet/call could be spewing -- if the guy was calling with an A or a J, we're screwed. Check-call at least leaves open the chance for a river bluff, he'll check behind with missed draws, and maybe he'll check behind a pocket pair he would have called with, but not often enough to make this an easy value bet.

chesspain · #9 04-17-2005, 05:10 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I lean towards betting here.

IMO, the whole 'let them bluff' tends to be over done at this limit.

He is likely to take a free showdown with the hands that beat us but with which he is willing to call (lower PPs), but will bet if he is beating us.

I dont think he bets KQ or the like often enough to making picking off a bluff better.

[/ QUOTE ]

No one is discussing the likelihood of his possibly having a better hand with which he will call a bet but not bet himself (e.g. ace with crappy kicker).

CallMeIshmael · #10 04-17-2005, 05:12 PM

[ QUOTE ]
No one is discussing the likelihood of his possibly having a better hand with which he will call a bet but not bet himself (e.g. ace with crappy kicker).

[/ QUOTE ]

I was assuming that he is very likely to bet anything that beats you. Do you think this is wrong?

If so, then check-call is looking better.