Lots of problems here at each street...KQo on Button

Maurader1 · #1 03-23-2005, 05:57 AM

No Reads...

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
4 folds, MP2 raises, 2 folds, Hero calls, 1 fold, BB calls.

Flop: (6.50 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB bets, MP2 raises, Hero ?? 

Anyone fold pf so I don't even have to worry about the rest of the hand?

Peter Harris · #2 03-23-2005, 06:06 AM

definite fold PF here readless at 1/2. If you are going to play you should 3-bet to isolate, cold calling with KQo is the sort of shenanigans that Ed Miller will whoop you upside your head for.

The flop situation is rotten, as you have TPGK but can now be behind to KJ (as well as AK, AA, KK, JJ) but one of them could be going mad with a flush draw. I don't like folding as you have a hand...but, i can't see paying 2BB more (minimum, probably up to 5BB) to make it to showdown.

Regards,
Pete Harris

hokke · #3 03-23-2005, 06:06 AM

Yes, without reads this is an easy pf fold.

kai · #4 03-23-2005, 06:12 AM

Miller says that really rarely you do cold call, i didnt really understand what the conditions are. How would this situation have to be different to cold call?

caggin · #5 03-23-2005, 06:19 AM

Yes, fold pf!

Flop is tough. MP2 probably has you beat (but not necessarily). That's why you should fold pf...most pf raising hands dominate KQ, and when you hit your hand, you aren't sure if you're good or not. You've got backdoor flush and straight draws, but the pot is small, you're only getting about 1:4. I think I fold, but I don't feel good about it.

ArturiusX · #6 03-23-2005, 06:25 AM

I'd call on the flop, you have the backdoor flush and a few others outs against AK.

But yeah, fold this preflop, or raise if your content on playing it.

Peter Harris · #7 03-23-2005, 06:33 AM

i don't think this can ever be a cold call situation - noone else has cold called in front, the opponent openraised and you don't really want 2 more players with random hands in.

I think if the villain was aggressive, i'd cold call with AA and try and keep the blinds in, but even then, if the villain was hyper aggressive i'd rather build a big HU pot than have the blinds in.

If more players had limped/coldcalled you could safely coldcall with pocket pairs/sooted aces, but that situation is inapplicable here.

jaxUp · #8 03-23-2005, 06:35 AM

[ QUOTE ]
How would this situation have to be different to cold call?

[/ QUOTE ]

I would never coldcall in this situation. Ever. I would either 3-bet to isolate the raiser, or fold. I usually only coldcall in situations like this:

2 limp, MP raises, 1 or 2 coldcall, I'm on the button with AXs, suited connectors, or something that plays well multiway.

Another is the following, though I'm not sure if it's right:

you are in the CO with AQo, 1 limper, a raise, 2 coldcalls

I play the first hand like that because it's good multiway (though a 3-bet isn't disgusting)

The second one is because it's not really good multiway, but there's not much you can do to knock people out, so I see the flop and reevaluate there (this thinking may be riddled with errors)

Peter Harris · #9 03-23-2005, 06:44 AM

i think the AQo example is fine unless the raiser is uber-tight and only raises AA-QQ/AK.

ArturiusX · #10 03-23-2005, 06:46 AM

Also, don't post so many hands.

Read the FaQ.

Make 2 replies to every one hand you post, even if its bad advice. One of the pooh bahs will correct you so don't worry about it. Replying is so much better than actually posting a hand, because its working through the logic of a hand backwards. Its good exercise.