5/10 QQ on TT9 flop... call/reraise?

deathpotato · #1 03-22-2005, 06:00 PM

SB is new to the table, it's his second hand, so no reads.
MP1 seems good, 23/6/2 over 50 hands, haven't seen him get out of line.

Obviously the call/reraise is indicative of a lot of strength here, with both SB and myself showing aggression. My question is, if I can't see him doing this with any hands that I beat, should I just fold the flop? I couldn't bring myself to, obviously, and would have continued only on a J or Q turn. As I don't quite have odds to chase my 2 outs for a queen and maybe 1 or slightly less to the backdoor straight, should I just be folding this flop, or has anyone ever seen someone do this with a hand I beat?

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
3 folds, MP1 calls, Hero raises, 3 folds, SB calls, 1 fold, MP1 calls.

Flop: (7 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, MP1 calls, Hero raises, SB calls, MP1 3-bets, Hero calls, SB folds.

Turn: (7.50 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP1 bets, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 8.50 BB

pokerkai · #2 03-22-2005, 06:29 PM

folding QQ overpair just feels so weak to me...

but i think i like it here.

deathpotato · #3 03-23-2005, 02:14 AM

Good to know. I felt so wimpy folding, I needed a second opinion [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

ErrantNight · #4 03-23-2005, 02:26 AM

folding the flop getting 1:14 would be a bad idea. even if the call turns out to be a little loose, it's worth making.

the turn on the other hand... i'm not sure what you get check 3-bet by that you'r ahead of at this point and you're drawing slim. if you think you're good roughly 1:5 unimproved you can call down here... I don't think you are...

I think it's particularly important not to fold the flop because there are other cards beside a Q that you'd like to see on the turn. namely the J, but a K or 8 might give you pause.

mtdoak · #5 03-23-2005, 02:34 AM

Heads up this is an easy check/call down.

noir · #6 03-23-2005, 03:39 AM

I think a key factor is that you don't know how this guy plays. 5-10 is a weird limit.

Perhaps he's playing higher or lower than usual. Maybe he has a strong draw (a lower-limit player that plays meekly preflop and then opens up) or is fond of bluffing paired boards v. a pre-flop raiser (a savvy upper-limit player with bankroll issues).

Yeah, these are pretty specific speculations, but they factor into the flop call I suppose.

The straightforward nature of his play gives me pause - I'm sure you'll be looking to see if a similar situation comes up with this guy.

deathpotato · #7 03-23-2005, 03:39 AM

Really? When he calls the first flop bet from SB then raises after SB calls my raise, it sure looks like he made the first call in order to keep me in the pot with what he thought were overcards, and upon seeing my show of strength and SB's call, felt like he could raise while keeping us in. I can't see myself being good here 1 in 8 times on the turn. Bluffing into a bet/caller and a raiser seems pretty unlikely.

GemiNiveK · #8 03-23-2005, 03:55 AM

I think I'd err to the side of check/call. Folding feels week, but yes, you feel beat. If you planned on playing with this guy for another 100 hands or so, I think it may have been worth paying for the information. When I don't have a read but I suspect someone is LAGish and I have a reasonably strong hand with a few outs, I'm often willing to pay for a little information once... Yeah, yeah, I know... "THAT'S A LEAK!" But it seems to work for me. I mean, now you never know. You were probably beat and saved yourself a few bucks, but think of the money you may have beaten out of this guy in later hands if he turned out to be a major LAG? [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]