Proper raise with middle pair/Ace kicker here?

A_C_Slater · #1 03-19-2005, 12:18 AM

Paradise 1-2
7 handed

UTG folds, MP1 calls, MP2 (post checks), CO folds, I limp on button with A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (raise here?), SB raises, BB folds, everyone calls.

(9 SB)
FLOP: 4 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

SB bets, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, I raise, SB calls, MP1 calls.

(7 BB)
TURN: 4 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

SB bets, MP1 calls, I fold.....(lame?)

Well what started out as a flop play question has turned into me eagerly seeking comments on all streetz.

And no, that's not a typo, I said streetz.

deepsquat · #2 03-19-2005, 02:01 AM

This is a bad raise imo, you prob dont have the best hand, the ace or 8 of spades may not help you. Therefore its not a raise for value nor for protection.

If you were next to act after the SB this would be a good raise as youd face the field with 2 cold and protect you hand and maybe earn a free card on the turn if u wanted it.

btspider · #3 03-19-2005, 02:03 AM

eh,
raise PF
call flop
fold turn (pot is smaller with the flop call)

oLyphant · #4 03-19-2005, 02:21 AM

I thought this would be a correct raise on the flop, because many times he could be betting his jacks, and a raise for free card play would usually work here, wouldn't it?

TripleH68 · #5 03-19-2005, 02:22 AM

AC,

Why did you fold the turn getting 9:1 closing the action? You may actually have the best hand and it is quite possible all five of your outs are clean if you are behind.

HHH.

elbuddha · #6 03-19-2005, 09:20 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I thought this would be a correct raise on the flop, because many times he could be betting his jacks, and a raise for free card play would usually work here, wouldn't it?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't like a free card play here for two reasons: because the board is kinda coordinated, and because we could actually be ahead now but lose if someone is given a free chance to spike an overcard. In other words, the free card is more likely to be helpful to our opponents than it is to us.