Fish with 0% "Fold BB to Steal%": How often to steal raise?

[ctv1116]

A perhaps theoretical situation: consider a player who will never fold his BB to a raise from the CO or Button (i.e. his Fold BB to Steal % is 0). This isn't as uncommon as you might think. Against such a player, you would want to raise the blind far more often than against a TAG (right?). So what is the ballpark range for the number of hands you'd raise on the button against such a loose BB? Obviously I'm not looking for 43.214% or anything like that, but just curious on how low your raising standards would go. Would it be 50% (any hand which is a favorite over a random hand), or higher (you now have position against a player who almost certainly plays poorly post-flop)?

[Alobar]

I would steal less against such a player.

you also have to take into account the people in the hand between you and the BB, you cant start stealing with J7o because you've got position on a randomhand, because you've got other potential callers.

[J.R.]

I think its highly dependent on the passiveness or aggressiveness of this always defender, as one trait can mitigate the positional disadvantage and the other exacerbates it.

[PennDisc]

I can't figure out why you would want to try to steal more, since stealing from him is impossible. He's not folding ANYTHING, so coming in with more marginal hands is just making his blind defense plays more correct. You'll also probably follow up your raise with continuation bets on the flop and turn even if you hit nothing, which a player like this will call with any pair, and be right to do so based on your play here. If the BB will call with any 2 then your the only thing your raise can accomplish is to fold out the SB, which can be worthwhile but this isn't a reason to start loosening up a lot on your steals. In fact, if the SB always/often defends too (player dependent) limping on the button could often be correct since you play better than both postflop - your implied odds will be better and their calling odds postflop will be worse.

[tablecop]

[ QUOTE ]
A perhaps theoretical situation: consider a player who will never fold his BB to a raise from the CO or Button (i.e. his Fold BB to Steal % is 0). This isn't as uncommon as you might think. Against such a player, you would want to raise the blind far more often than against a TAG (right?).

[/ QUOTE ]

i don't know about "far" more often. some of the previous posters (and HEFAP for that matter) seem to put too much importance on the word "steal." as you've suggested, you'd be raising for value if raising the at least top 40% (from the button) and there's absolutely no reason to tighten up your "stealing" standards vs a looser than average BB. the average BB will defend with nearly 70% of his hands at PP 5/T (6 max) (assuming no 3bet intervening) and i haven't found much value in altering my already fairly loose open raising standards from the CO (28%) or button (40%) if he's looser or tighter than that. (i've found most of the FBB > 60% types are smart enough to notice if your start raising any two)

[ctv1116]

Well the raise would be for value (not for "Stealing" per se). You already are a statistical favorite if you raise only your top 50% of your hands, and given that you have position and (hopefully) superior post-flop play, in theory you should be able to make 50-60% of hands profitable by raising from the button.

Is this line of thinking correct?

[J.R.]

do you discount the opponent's level of aggression in evaluating this situation?

[ctv1116]

I guess the opponent's level of aggression can be lumped into the postflop play assumption. Like more aggressive players are just generally more difficult to play against postflop, so you'd probably want to steal less against them to a real loose-passive.