Turn Action: 40-80 Northern CA

[esspo]

Good game. Loose and VERY passive for the most part.

MP is a tough playing regular. For those in the know its Henry. We have played plenty together so we know each other pretty well.

Button is a young asain guy whose stuck, but seems like he has a clue. Very capable of laying down a hand on the turn when he thinks he is beat. However, I got the impression he is still in the phase where he is infatuated with making fancy moves.

My image at the time, except for the regulars, is just one of the gang. I have been playing a lot more hands than usual because there have been so many profitable opportunities to overlimp with suited connectors.

Pre-Flop: Two loose limpers limp in EP, Henry limps in MP, one more MP limper, I limp with QJd in HJ, button raises, blinds and all the limpers call.

Flop: K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 10 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. All check to button who bets, folded to Henry who calls, I call. 3 to the turn for 9.5BB.

Turn: x. Henry checks, I bet.

Comments?

[scrub]

[ QUOTE ]
Pre-Flop: Two loose limpers limp in EP, Henry limps in MP, one more MP limper, I limp with QJd in HJ, button raises, blinds and all the limpers call.


[/ QUOTE ]

Why didn't you raise preflop?

scrub

[Roy Hobbs]

Usually, when I see this play, it screams draw (given your position, wouldn't you have checkraised with a King or better once you had him and Henry in there for a small bet), and I'll raise a lot of medium strength hands. This might not be a terrible situation here, because you could conceivably clean up your Q and J outs by forcing Henry to face a double bet.

But you said that the player on the button is willing to fold when he's beat. So are you trying to get him out so that you can take the pot down on the river against Henry when he misses his draw? If the button folds, I think that it's likely that you get looked up by Henry.

How often is he going to check through on the turn when he's up against two solid players who have called his flop bet?

RH

[Boris]

I think in this case you are better off to check and hope for a free card on the turn. I see very little possibility of taking it down on the turn so if you want to run a bluff here it is going to cost you two bets. You also have to bluff out two players and will get raised a fair amount of the time as well.

[esspo]

This seemed like the perfect overlimping spot for a couple of reason. First, the game was passive for the most part, but if given the opportunity, a couple of the players left to act (including the blinds) were more than capable of 3-betting. Second, if any of the limpy limpers caught any peice of the board I was going to have to show down the best hand to win the pot.

This is one of those spots where HPFAP advocates raising if it will entice people to stay for the ride if the flop hits you, but these players didn't need any incentivizing.

[lighterjobs]

i would have MAYBE re-raised the bet on the flop. depending on the table. also, i would have checked the turn because i doubt this guy was going anywhere.

[esspo]

[ QUOTE ]
So are you trying to get him out so that you can take the pot down on the river against Henry when he misses his draw?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes. If button cooperated and folded the plan was to bet any non-spade river. Henry acted before me on the flop after ALL those limpy limpers folded. We both know that the button does not have to have a big hand there. He would not need a K to try to force me and the last limper out. Ergo, he's drawing. Of course I could be wrong and he would almost assuradly look me up with something like AT or possibly less.

[esspo]

[ QUOTE ]
I see very little possibility of taking it down on the turn so if you want to run a bluff here it is going to cost you two bets.

[/ QUOTE ]

I thought I had almost no chance of taking it down on the turn. I did think a turn bet would setup a solid bluff on a blank river, IF button folded. If button had something I would get popped, but he could have such a wide range of hands I didn't think it was very likely.

I was calling a turn bet for sure, why not add some river bluffing equity to boot.

[esspo]

[ QUOTE ]
i would have MAYBE re-raised the bet on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why? You aren't driving anyone out and that line would have given you zero info on the turn about MP's hand until after you bet (assuming you follow through with the bluff).

[scrub]

[ QUOTE ]
This seemed like the perfect overlimping spot for a couple of reason. First, the game was passive for the most part, but if given the opportunity, a couple of the players left to act (including the blinds) were more than capable of 3-betting. Second, if any of the limpy limpers caught any peice of the board I was going to have to show down the best hand to win the pot.

This is one of those spots where HPFAP advocates raising if it will entice people to stay for the ride if the flop hits you, but these players didn't need any incentivizing.

[/ QUOTE ]

If the limpers were as bad as you describe, QJs is worth a raise on equity grounds alone, in addition to the fact that it may give you the button for the rest of the hand and make it harder for a strong player like Henry to characterize your holding.

This strikes me as a situation where a big game is playing more like a small game, but you're still treating it like a big game...

scrub