30/60 5 handed 34o

[Paluka]

5 handed 30/60 game online. The other 4 players are atrocious.
UTG limps. He limps with all sorts of hands, including ones that he should probably raise with. He makes all sorts of different bad plays, so it is hard to really pinpoint what sort of moron he is. Next 2 guys fold and the sb who is a supermoron limps. You check with 34o in the bb.
Flop 23K rainbow. Sb checks, you bet, utg calls, sb folds
Turn K putting 2 hearts on board. You bet, utg raises. Whaddya think my play is?

[mike l.]

fold. i mean, the guy sounds most like your run of the mill loose passive bad moron and he is mainly paying attention to what he has not what he thinks you have. he just made trip kings way too often to make continuing with the hand correct. the pot is not big, the player is not smart or tricky, you must fold here.

[Nomar]

FOLD

give him a pocket pair, a king, a better 4, whatever, fold and move on.

[Paluka]

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FOLD



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My original thought was fold. But I really could not imagine him waiting until the turn to raise with a king in a small pot like this. This seems especially true because if he has a king it is probably a weaker one which he wont' think is good enough to slowplay. Raising the turn here with a pocket pair also seems pretty strange- why open yourself up to getting 3 bet if you have pocket 7s? And if you do have pocket 7s do you really think pocket 9s is folding? There is also a heart draw on board now he could semibluff with, and I also think that bad playres think that the top card on the board pairing is a good spot to bluff in.
I decided to call him, but now I wonder if maybe 3 betting isn't better.

[DeezNutz3]

a better 4?

[mike l.]

"Raising the turn here with a pocket pair also seems pretty strange-"

to you. to a bad player who doesnt know what he's doing it might seem like the right random play at any given time.

anyway i think if we stick with the idea of him having a K of some sort and the pot being small we will profit long term big time.

[anatta]

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But I really could not imagine him waiting until the turn to raise with a king in a small pot like this.

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Since you said you really cannot read exactly how fishy he is, just that he is bad, I think your assumption is bit of a stretch. It looks like you are saying "I can't imagine him playing correctly" since the smaller the pot, the more correct he is to slowplay the king. Is he really this realiably bad?

You also said he probably wouldn't slowplay a weak king since he might think its too weak despite it being five handed and a flop of KXX where it makes little difference usually how weak your kicker is. While I can see this being true, i.e. maybe you read him as someone who thinks slowplaying is a bold play needing more than top pair kings weak kicker, unless he has shown more specific tendencies, I would read him the way I would read most players here, he could be (correctly) slowplaying his king. Also I think its rare to find someone who is too timid to slowplay top pair but will bluff raise the turn.

I would need some read like "he bluff-raises way too much on Big-little-little boards" or "he has seen me bluff at KXX and now he is probably making a play" to call down here.

[Paluka]

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Since you said you really cannot read exactly how fishy he is, just that he is bad, I think your assumption is bit of a stretch.

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I just don't think that bad players in general call the flop and then raise the turn with top pair type hands in general. They play those sorts of hands much more straight forward.

[mike l.]

ive noticed what happens with bad players is they play with some element of randomness. they just dont have any solid fundamental footing in the game. they raise sometimes and just call other times. they let their mood, how theyve been running, all sorts of things dictate their plays. they arent completely random, but they are very loose and the higher the limits the more likely they are to have random spurts of aggression that are hard to track, hard to make sense of. i think this is one of those cases. for whatever strange reason this guy flat called the flop here with his K5 or AK or whatever and now that he's made trips he's still not thinking about what you could have, he is just saying "duh ma, me make three of a kind on the tern there!" as he clicks the raise button.

ironically this randomness makes them actually a little better at limit hold em, a little less easy to read.

[eugeneel123]