How bad did I play this? K9s button

Mr. Graff · #1 02-01-2005, 08:27 AM

I'm primarily interested in comments on the flop.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. MP posts a blind of $5.
UTG calls, MP (poster) checks, Hero raises, SB calls, 1 fold, UTG calls, MP calls.

Flop: (9 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, UTG bets, MP raises, Hero 3-bets, SB folds, UTG calls, MP calls.

Turn: (9 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
UTG checks, MP bets, Hero raises, UTG folds, MP 3-bets, Hero calls.

River: (15 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
MP bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 17 BB

I think this hand was played pretty much as bad as it could be. Both preflop and turn I'd play different if I had the chance to play it again. But my real question is about the flop. My immediate thought was to punish draws and not give someone credit for a hand better than mine but am I facing too much aggression to continue with this hand considering the combination 1) I might be drawing dead or near dead 2) the chances a draw will arrive?

Assume
1) no reads
2) MP very loose, will frequently bet into PFR, CO semi-tight preflop, rather passive postflop.
I'm mostly interested in comments on situation no. 1.

spydog · #2 02-01-2005, 09:19 AM

Preflop: Good

Flop: I like the 3-bet. You have position with a hand that is likely to be ahead. UTG could be betting with a draw or any piece and MP could be raising with a draw or any piece.

Turn: If you raise this turn then you must fold to a 3-bet from MP as it screams set/2-pair. If you call then you must be prepared to fold a diamond river. Folding to the original bet isn't a horrible mistake here either.

Mr. Graff · #3 02-01-2005, 05:22 PM

No way you could let go of this hand on the flop? Say I had limped preflop instead making the pot less attractive and you knew CO had a postflop aggression factor around 1, i.e. on the passive side and not too likely to pump draws.

Bluffoon · #4 02-01-2005, 05:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'm primarily interested in comments on the flop.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. MP posts a blind of $5.
UTG calls, MP (poster) checks, Hero raises, SB calls, 1 fold, UTG calls, MP calls.

Flop: (9 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, UTG bets, MP raises, Hero 3-bets, SB folds, UTG calls, MP calls.

Turn: (9 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
UTG checks, MP bets, Hero raises, UTG folds, MP 3-bets, Hero calls.

River: (15 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
MP bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 17 BB

I think this hand was played pretty much as bad as it could be. Both preflop and turn I'd play different if I had the chance to play it again. But my real question is about the flop. My immediate thought was to punish draws and not give someone credit for a hand better than mine but am I facing too much aggression to continue with this hand considering the combination 1) I might be drawing dead or near dead 2) the chances a draw will arrive?

Assume
1) no reads
2) MP very loose, will frequently bet into PFR, CO semi-tight preflop, rather passive postflop.
I'm mostly interested in comments on situation no. 1.

[/ QUOTE ]

I like the flop three bet. You can't really fold there and raising is far far better than calling. With MP coming right back at you after the flop reraise I think to continue on the turn you had to pick something up. With that brick Im outta there....

Inthacup · #5 02-01-2005, 05:47 PM

I think your flop play is fine, but your call down is pretty bad. This is assuming no reads.

Cup

Mr. Graff · #6 02-01-2005, 06:02 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'm primarily interested in comments on the flop.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. MP posts a blind of $5.
UTG calls, MP (poster) checks, Hero raises, SB calls, 1 fold, UTG calls, MP calls.

Flop: (9 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, UTG bets, MP raises, Hero 3-bets, SB folds, UTG calls, MP calls.

Turn: (9 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
UTG checks, MP bets, Hero raises, UTG folds, MP 3-bets, Hero calls.

River: (15 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
MP bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 17 BB

I think this hand was played pretty much as bad as it could be. Both preflop and turn I'd play different if I had the chance to play it again. But my real question is about the flop. My immediate thought was to punish draws and not give someone credit for a hand better than mine but am I facing too much aggression to continue with this hand considering the combination 1) I might be drawing dead or near dead 2) the chances a draw will arrive?

Assume
1) no reads
2) MP very loose, will frequently bet into PFR, CO semi-tight preflop, rather passive postflop.
I'm mostly interested in comments on situation no. 1.

[/ QUOTE ]

I like the flop three bet. You can't really fold there and raising is far far better than calling. With MP coming right back at you after the flop reraise I think to continue on the turn you had to pick something up. With that brick Im outta there....

[/ QUOTE ]
I agree. I had become too attached to the thought that he was was drawing and I wanted to punish that though everything about his play and his AF numbers suggested otherwise. Just a badly played hand.

New batch coming your way if you don't mind and have the time, Jimmy... Not all of them a pretty ones, I can promise you that... But luckily the opponents have been even fishier than me lately [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

helpmeout · #7 02-01-2005, 06:36 PM

I limp preflop, already a limper and a poster this hand isnt strong enough to raise.

Probably best to dump this on the flop, would be much easier if you hadnt raised preflop.

Without a read its better to assume you are behind here. I dont think a J bets out or raises on the flop.

Inthacup · #8 02-01-2005, 07:00 PM

There are many hands other than a J that will bet and raise the flop.

helpmeout · #9 02-01-2005, 07:16 PM

yeah a flushdraw or a K or better.

I dont think a flush draw is going to raise here to knock people out.

One of them likely has a K or better.

Inthacup · #10 02-01-2005, 07:42 PM

AK, KQ and most likely KJ would have raised preflop. Most times, I see K 10 raise too, so I don't really see how you can confidently narrow down either hand to a better king.