Two hands: one good, one bad

[shiburu]

Both of these hands occured in a $.50/$1 online game.

1. I was drawing to a one-card, gut-shot straight (board: 569x, me: 88) against three opponents. At the turn there were two hearts on the board, and the river came 7 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], completing my straight, but putting three of a suit on the board. One player bet (as he had previously in the hand), but the next player (who had been calling like me) raised. The pot was laying me 5:1 odds to call with my non-nut straight with a possible flush on the board. With T8 and two hearts both possible (likely, as I thought at the time), and two players behind who could reraise, I folded. The river raiser showed down 34 for a 7-high straight, and took my $10. After reading SSH, I now know that folding the best hand on the river is the biggest mistake in Limit Hold'em, but given the pot odds, action, and possible better hands, was my fold such a mistake from a theoretical perspective, neverminding hindsight? I don't want this to be one of those hands that teaches me a bad lesson.

2. I flop the nut flush (plus royal flush draw) against 4 or 5 players. Betting had been capped pre-flop (which made me a little unhappy) and post-flop (which made me very happy). The board was K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] on the flop, me holding A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]x [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. I was feeling on top of the world when the T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] hit the turn. My heart sank. The capping stopped, but the raising continued disgusting me. I flat-called to the showdown fearing the inevitable kings full, queens full, or quad tens. They all mucked and I won a pot at least 6 or 8 BB too small. Same syndrome as hand #1. Same question? Is hindsight making me question my own sound judgment?

[Aaron W.]

You should really use your hand histories and use the bison hand converter (just look at a few other posts). The way things are presented, it's very difficult to actually give you a clean analysis.

[ QUOTE ]
1. I was drawing to a one-card, gut-shot straight (board: 569x, me: 88) against three opponents. At the turn there were two hearts on the board, and the river came 7 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], completing my straight, but putting three of a suit on the board. One player bet (as he had previously in the hand), but the next player (who had been calling like me) raised. The pot was laying me 5:1 odds to call with my non-nut straight with a possible flush on the board. With T8 and two hearts both possible (likely, as I thought at the time), and two players behind who could reraise, I folded. The river raiser showed down 34 for a 7-high straight, and took my $10. After reading SSH, I now know that folding the best hand on the river is the biggest mistake in Limit Hold'em, but given the pot odds, action, and possible better hands, was my fold such a mistake from a theoretical perspective, neverminding hindsight? I don't want this to be one of those hands that teaches me a bad lesson.

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Without knowing anything about your positions and your reads, this is very difficult to analyze. If the river is laying you 5:1 for 2 BB, then the pot is at 10 BB when the action gets to you... this looks like 5 players for no raise seeing the flop, 3 callers on the flop, 3 on the turn.

If you limped in early-mid position, that's fine. On the flop, you may have wanted to fold your gutshot if the bettor was generally passive. If he were more agressive, raising your pair would be better to drive out overcards. Putting the flop play aside, you probably should have folded on the turn.

[ QUOTE ]
2. I flop the nut flush (plus royal flush draw) against 4 or 5 players. Betting had been capped pre-flop (which made me a little unhappy) and post-flop (which made me very happy). The board was K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] on the flop, me holding A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]x [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. I was feeling on top of the world when the T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] hit the turn. My heart sank. The capping stopped, but the raising continued disgusting me. I flat-called to the showdown fearing the inevitable kings full, queens full, or quad tens. They all mucked and I won a pot at least 6 or 8 BB too small. Same syndrome as hand #1. Same question? Is hindsight making me question my own sound judgment?

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You shouldn't be seeing the flop with Axs when it's capped. That's really bad.