Call two on the river here?

Xiphoid · #1 01-12-2005, 01:17 AM

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG folds, Hero calls, UTG+2 folds, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO folds, Button calls, SB raises, BB folds, Hero calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, Button calls.

Flop: (11 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB bets, Hero raises, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, Button folds, SB calls.

Turn: (9.50 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, MP1 calls, MP3 folds, SB calls.

River: (12.50 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, MP1 raises, SB 3-bets, Hero calls, MP1 caps, SB calls, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 24.50 BB

pindawg · #2 01-12-2005, 01:28 AM

I'd lay it down. One of them can beat at least 2 pair.

molawn2mo · #3 01-12-2005, 01:31 AM

fine up to the river, then...
check/call one bet. being check 3 bet is the pits. you have bet your hand big until the river and then you gotta give it up. spit happens.

sb looks like AQ or AT. MP1 has a set.

Harv72b · #4 01-12-2005, 01:37 AM

You're only getting 9:1 immediate to call behind 2 raisers on the river, with a cap possible behind you. Unless you're sure both of these guys would go crazy with top pair on the river, you have to lay it down when it's 2 bets back to you.

FWIW, SB's play looks more to me like someone who hit an OESD, although it's tough to imagine someone raising KJs from the SB, behind 5 limpers. I'm actually tempted to think this is just a horribly misplayed AK on his part (I think AQ would've 3-bet the flop, or checkraised the turn). But MP1 is more likely to either have the straight or AT.

Gravy (Gravy Smoothie) · #5 01-12-2005, 01:39 AM

[ QUOTE ]
fine up to the river, then...
check/call one bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is an easy river value bet. You will be paid off by AJ/AK/JJ from the SB, not to mention the crap that MP1 most likely has. You can lay it down to the check/3-bet but if you think I'm going to check/call this river you are crazy.

mr pink · #6 01-12-2005, 01:42 AM

anybody else like waiting till the turn to raise here?

peace - jeff

molawn2mo · #7 01-12-2005, 02:06 AM

That river ace is an abortion and you should try and showdown as cheap as possible. Aggressive is one thing but reality is another.

Who knows maybe the river goes check, check, and you induce a river bluff from a weaker hand.

Xiphoid · #8 01-12-2005, 02:18 AM

I think leading the river with a bet is always the right play there. You win there a good portion of the time.

I do think I made a mistake calling two after that.

MP1 showed KJs for a straight and SB had AA. It was a magic card for both of them, rendering my 70% favorite on the turn to not even second best on the river.

Thanks for the comments.

mr pink · #9 01-12-2005, 02:20 AM

raising the turn might have been a better play

mannika · #10 01-12-2005, 03:24 AM

[ QUOTE ]
raising the turn might have been a better play

[/ QUOTE ]

With all the huge draws out? Anyone with a J/9 has a gutshot, and there is also a flush draw out. Think raising the flop here is the right play, rather than waiting until the turn.

Edit: I just saw the argument for waiting until the turn to raise. It's probably a bit more marginal, but I still like raising now, just because of the huge amount of scare cards that can come on the turn.