Hitting bottom set on the turn

[Post-Oak]

2/4 NL ($400 max) I ($386) am viewed as tight, BB ($526) is not terrible but I would not call him solid (see further description below). I don't know enough about the short stacked UTG+1 ($132) to have an opinion, but his name is ICEMAN5 and I was thinking it could be the poster who posts here under the same exact name. Given that he horribly misplayed this hand, I don't think it could be the same player. Of course, I did not know this until he showed his cards.

I'm sitting UTG+4 and am dealt 4h 4c. The preflop action went like this: UTG+2 limps, UTG+3 limps, UTG+4 makes it 18 to go, I call, BB calls, UTG+2 calls, UTG+3 calls. 5 see the flop.

Flop (pot = $92):
6s 7h 9c

Checked around.

Turn ($92):
4s

BB checks. UTG+1 bets $11. Folded to me and I raise to $105. BB raises all-in. He has us both covered. I have $263 left and UTG+1 has $103. UTG+1 calls. There is now $574 in the pot and I have $263 left.

I see the BB as a bit of a weak player. His problem is he can't lay down hands like 2 pair, even when someone bets big on the river and the board is scary. I've seen him call off a lot of money this way. I also have a note that he got it all-in with QQ preflop against a good player (and he was the caller). So I don't have too much respect for his game, but this all-in check raise is not something I would consider normal if he had 2 pair. He tends to lose money by calling with those hands, but not being insanely aggressive with them.

Thoughts? I will give my thought process with the results.

[TOmCowley]

I think he has a set or a straight, not that it matters which. Would he call with T8s in the BB? I'm sure he'd call with a mid PP. Out of position, he tried to CR the flop and nobody cooperated. The turn was a blank for the 3-straight, but it brought a flush draw and most likely helped nobody, so betting out would likely fold the table (UTG+1 can't even call a 13 outer without your 100 in there too), which isn't the best result. He tried to CR again, you cooperated, and he really didn't want to give you another card to the flush draw (or to a lame straight draw if he just had a set). I don't think it matters which one he has, becase even if it's a straight, you don't have odds to call to boat it, and god help you if it's an overset. UTG+1 smells like a flush draw+pair/gutshot (A7s? ATs?), but he's irrelevant IMO.

[Post-Oak]

<<<<Would he call with T8s in the BB?>>>>

That would be very unlikely for this opponent. I thus discounted the possibility of a straight, but I foolishly considered that he might have two pair. These conclusions are inconsistent. This was really the result of wishful thinking on my part.

<<<<I'm sure he'd call with a mid PP.>>>>

That's what I was afraid of, but I foolishly called anyway. The fact that I don't respect the player's game that much, combined with the decent sized pot, led me to make a really bad call. I was hoping he was just getting out of line. After reviewing the hand history, I thought the call was horrible. Your excellent analysis confirms what I thought of the hand (after review).

Oh, he had 66 for a flopped set. The short stack had 5-10, for a gutshot to a non-nut straight. Someone asked him what the hell he was doing and he said "I was pot committed". At least he made me look good in comparison.

[Niwa]

Haha Hilarious [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] "I was pot-comitted"

[queenhigh]

with that kind of flop in a big multiway pot that got checked around, a set or straight or pair+draw are all likely holdings...i think i'd smooth call (or raise less)with my set of fours, since if you raise that big on the turn you're not going to get called by many draws (usually) and certainly no worse hands, and hope you fill up when someone makes a straight/flush