Limping with 9s - Re-raised back to you.

MagicRat · #1 11-23-2004, 12:28 PM

Both raisers seemed like pretty decent players.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls, Hero calls, 2 folds, MP2 raises, MP3 calls, 2 folds, SB 3-bets, 1 fold, UTG calls, Hero calls, MP2 calls, MP3 calls.

Do you ever give this up pre-flop once you're in??

fairness · #2 11-23-2004, 12:29 PM

hate to admit it but you should have raised first

fairness · #3 11-23-2004, 12:30 PM

and calling the 2 back to you is good, 99 is getting crazy implied odds on hitting a set

jay1313 · #4 11-23-2004, 12:37 PM

Yeah this is a tough one, 99 is right at the bottom of raising in early position. I do raise first in with it, but the cold calls always throw me. Having it re-raised back to me on the limp is very difficult to figure out. My play at this point would be to call it. If I raised first in and it came back capped, I would call. This is one of those marginal hands that define your play. At this point JJ - 88 are difficult hands for me, they are all profitable so far but I need practice working on when to be aggressive and when to save a few bets by admitting defeat. How did it turn out?

MagicRat · #5 11-23-2004, 01:00 PM

I've "progressed" to the point where I'd auto-raise down to 10s but with 9s it seems to depend on my mood; I'm probably raising it UTG, UTG+1, EP 50% of the time - maybe I need to work on that.

Anyway, on to the flop!

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls, Hero calls, 2 folds, MP2 raises, MP3 calls, 2 folds, SB 3-bets, 1 fold, UTG calls, Hero calls, MP2 calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (16 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB bets, UTG folds, Hero raises, MP2 calls, MP3 folds, SB calls.

Lucky me! Thought about slow-playing this but I'm probably up against at least 1 bigger pair and the pot's already pretty huge so I'm pedal-to-the-metal from the outset. Correct play?

GrunchCan · #6 11-23-2004, 01:04 PM

Correct play?

Yes, correct play. Pot's too big to slowplay, and your opponent is not going to fold to a raise anyway. Any thinking that allows you to slowplay in this spot is just wrong.

nolanfan34 · #7 11-23-2004, 01:08 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Thought about slow-playing this but I'm probably up against at least 1 bigger pair and the pot's already pretty huge so I'm pedal-to-the-metal from the outset. Correct play?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd smooth call the flop here, and wait to see what the other PF raiser does. To me, this fits the definition of slowplaying, because it's not a dangerous flop for the range of hands that the PF raisers probably have. Most likely, if one has AK and the other has QQ, they're each drawing to either 2 outs, or a runner runner of some sort.

If the flop was more coordinated, I'd probably ram and jam. But rainbow like this, I'm waiting until the turn to wake up. Overpairs may slow down if you wake up on the flop, raising and capping it.

It's a close call either way, but I see people slow down on the turn and call down when I make my move early, more than they keep ramming and jamming in the 1-2 game.

nolanfan34 · #8 11-23-2004, 01:11 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Correct play?

Yes, correct play. Pot's too big to slowplay, and your opponent is not going to fold to a raise anyway. Any thinking that allows you to slowplay in this spot is just wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree. Yes, the pot is big. And yes, your opponents aren't folding. But I'd rather pop them on the turn, for the bigger bet, when you likely have a lock hand.

On a paired flop like this, a big pair will slow down if you show strength IMO. You also have a deceptive hand if something like a T or J falls on the turn, because if you start betting and raising, an overpair to the board will probably give you action, if they think you have a counterfeited two pair.

slickterp · #9 11-23-2004, 01:22 PM

that worked out for you. i was going to say that with that many people in the pot you should still go in and look for your set, but fold if it doesn't coe and some overcards come.

fairness · #10 11-23-2004, 01:22 PM

i'm going w/ ryan on this one, this flop is silly for your hand. your opponents are almost drawing dead. if either has a higher pocket pair they're drawing to a 2 outer. they're unlikely to fold to a flop raise, i'd wait till the turn to go crazy.