Steal gone bad, what do you do?

[dauler]

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (10 handed)

UTG+1 ($121.25)
UTG+2 ($133.70)
MP1 ($49)
MP2 ($110.50)
MP3 ($38.50)
CO ($32.75)
Hero ($43.90)
SB ($165.40)
BB ($43)
UTG ($50.40)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 folds, MP1 calls $1, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises to $4</font>, SB folds, BB folds, MP1 calls $3.

With only 1 limper and myself on the button, I went for a steal with QTo figuring I wouldn't get too attached to it if I didn't connect and I was called.

Flop: ($9.50) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
MP1 checks, <font color="CC3333">Hero bets $8</font>, MP1 calls $8.

I couldn't have asked for a better flop, I've got top pair with a good kicker and have no reason to put him on an overpair, I basically bet the pot trying to take it down right there but I would feel comfortable that I still had the best hand if I was called.

Turn: ($25.50) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
MP1 checks, Hero...

This was a horrible turn card for me, I didn't know what he was calling with but Ax was certainly a possibility in my mind, a pocket pair or other overcards like QJs were possibilities too. How do you guys play it from here, and how was my play on other streets?

[amoeba]

I would bet 1/2 pot on the turn. Although his play does seem indicative of AT or 77 if he calls or raises your turn bet.But he could just as likely be holding KQ or KJ and fold to your turn bet.

[Sephus]

bet 10-15, fold to a raise.

[VBM]

Even on the button, especially if i'm shortstacked, i wouldn't have raised QTo.
it's too much of a dominated hand...

i agree with the guys before, bet some decent increment, fold to a raise...

[amoeba]

well, he did admit it was a steal. In any case, its less important what you do on the turn. Its more important that you show your steal so you get paid on your bigger hands next time.

[ctide]

Don't steal in this game. There are a few players in this game who will play back at you for the remainder of the hand because they don't want you to feel like you can steal their blind. I know that I personally have played back at button stealers many times, and gotten them to fold by bullying them right back.

On top of that, now you're stuck w/ the hand because you've hit top pair, but you still don't have a very strong hand.

Anyways, I personally would check behind on the turn, call a 1/2 pot sized bet on the river, or raise it up if I improve. Flop play is fine.

[dauler]

I didn't want to give him credit for the ace so I ended up pushing on the turn and he instacalled me with A2, thanks for the advice on the better play.

A few people mentioned not liking the steal attempt with QTo, what hands do you like to steal with and under what conditions? I almost never attempt to steal, this was one of my first times and I didn't know how to handle it.

[bobman0330]

I think it's a beautiful steal hand... At low limits, one of the biggest mistakes people make is that they won't reraise in situations like that... take advantage of that mistake by playing hands that you wouldn't mind seeing a flop with. that way if your steal doesn't work, you can always fall back on making a hand.

[rickr]

I try not to steal with even hands that remotely stand a chance of winning. I like to steal by position and number already in the pot. Hand doesn't matter. I fbet into on the flop, drop it if I miss. If hit hard, raise. If Checked to me, fire a bet to win the pot. If called, noew you start worrying.

[Zag]

[ QUOTE ]
1. I didn't want to give him credit for the ace so I ended up pushing on the turn and ...
2. what hands do you like to steal with and under what conditions?

[/ QUOTE ]

1. This was a terrible play, IMHO. If you are still ahead on the turn, then he doesn't have very many outs, and he probably won't call a bet anyway. (Note that there are no realistic draws.) If you are behind, there is no way you will get him to fold. So the only profit you see from a bet is if he would have folded but then he hits his (very few) outs. Given the propensity of PP players to be playing Ax here, this is an easy check behind.

In these games, I think of an ace on the turn the same way I do in limit poker -- I immediately suspect that some idiot has just made two pair with his Ax, and I am either looking to minimize damage or to maximize gain if I can beat aces up. So in this case you are looking to minimize. Note that a check behind also has some value as a bluff-inducer, too, so it still has some value even if you are still ahead. Of course, it means that you have to decide whether or not to call if he bets out the river, but even checking and always calling on the river beats betting out, here.

2. I totally disagree with whoever said this was a bad steal hand. QT was a great hand to raise with preflop, in the case you were in (on the button or cutoff, everyone has folded to you). If you are called, it still has hopes of making a decent hand (as you did) but don't forget that the real value you are looking for is just to steal the blinds. QT is ahead of one random hand, and about even with two random hands, plus you have position AND initiative.

Besides, look at what happened! You got some idiot to call you with A2, and then to call a 3/4 pot bet with only 5 outs. Of course, the fact that you gave him the implied odds means that he possibly was correct to make that call, but soon you won't be.