Flopping top set and getting KILLED!

DimensionPresident · #1 09-08-2004, 03:30 PM

I have to vent a bit. This boggles my mind that it has happened 4 times in my last 4 tournys. All have been at the final table in a multi table tournament.

Flop comes and I hit the top set. Each time there's been two or three guys in. The latest one I checked, guy bet about 25% of average chip stack. Another player called. I go all in. I get a call and am beat by a flush on the river.

Another time I made a huge bet after the flop to try to push out flush draws. That didn't work. Got called beat by a flush on the turn that time.

I've tried both ways, and my sets keep getting killed by a flush. I have no idea what to do? Should I just never raise and call till the end? Anytime I bet, no matter how much, I get called by the flush draws.

Bad Beat Story Detector · #2 09-08-2004, 03:38 PM

Alert! Alert! Alert!
The preceeding post is merely a bad beat story disguised as a tournament strategy question. Please disregard as to not encourage this behavior any further. Thank you for your time.

Cleveland Guy · #3 09-08-2004, 03:38 PM

Top set is about 3-1 vs. a naked flush.

Keep pushing and hoping you get called. Don't mistake short term odds for the long term right play.

DimensionPresident · #4 09-08-2004, 03:45 PM

Funny. Nice name.

If I really wanted to post a bad beat story I would be more specific, and maybe even use icons like these [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] , but I am honestly wondering what I should do.

These are tournaments and these hands are sending me packing.

Or maybe I am just playing with maniacs who are willing to risk their stacks to hit their flush on the turn or river?

Is this a play anyone here would make? Say you have Ax suited in your hand and the flop has two of your suit. Would you risk a lot of your chips (or go all in) to hit your flush on the last two cards?

Cleveland Guy · #5 09-08-2004, 04:14 PM

On the first one - since he had already bet 25% of the pot, and there was another caller, if he had you covered, depending on how much of his stack it was - he might have had the odds to call. Hard to know without knowing actualy bets, pot sizes, blinds. etc.

The second- that's a tough call, unless he has you way outchipped, where he is risking very little of his chips.

fnurt · #6 09-08-2004, 04:42 PM

If you are consistently getting all of your money in with the nuts on the flop, you don't need our help. Sometimes cards happen.

PokerNeal · #7 09-08-2004, 04:49 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I have to vent a bit. This boggles my mind that it has happened 4 times in my last 4 tournys. All have been at the final table in a multi table tournament.

Flop comes and I hit the top set. Each time there's been two or three guys in. The latest one I checked, guy bet about 25% of average chip stack. Another player called. I go all in. I get a call and am beat by a flush on the river.

Another time I made a huge bet after the flop to try to push out flush draws. That didn't work. Got called beat by a flush on the turn that time.

I've tried both ways, and my sets keep getting killed by a flush. I have no idea what to do? Should I just never raise and call till the end? Anytime I bet, no matter how much, I get called by the flush draws.

[/ QUOTE ]

You just had a bad run of luck. Has happened to the best of us. You did nothing wrong. By the time you read this post you probably have won a couple of tourneys doing the very same plays...

DimensionPresident · #8 09-09-2004, 04:05 PM

Thanks for the encouragement.

What would be the standard way (if there is one) to play a set on the flop when there is also two suited cards on the flop?

Do you push and try to fold draws?
Do you not push and just make a "big bet" to try to fold draws?
Do you play more conservative and wait to see if the flush draw comes on turn or river... and fold if another player pushes in on you?

SossMan · #9 09-09-2004, 04:15 PM

You do whatever the hell you can to get all the chips in the middle. YOU HAVE TOP SET! GET CHIPS IN THE MIDDLE AND LET FATE TAKE OVER FROM THERE. VERY OFTEN THEY WILL BE DRAWING TO RUNNER RUNNER QUADS!!

DimensionPresident · #10 09-09-2004, 04:34 PM

Believe me, that's what went through my head for awhile until I started to get burned on the hand. Isn't the percentage for another suited card to hit on the turn or river like 35%?

So I only have a 65% of making it through without the possibility of losing to a flush. I am starting to think that slow playing the hand to see what the turn and river are might be best. 65% is good, but when you're at the final table of a tournmanet, it may not be best to risk your entire stack on if you can do so without pushing on the flop...

This is getting me paranoid. [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]