I just didn't think I was behind

SpiderMnkE · #1 09-02-2004, 10:23 PM

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (6 max, 6 handed)

saw flop|saw showdown

UTG ($64.75)
MP ($78.60)
CO ($31)
Hero ($115.38)
SB ($43.90)
BB ($170.25)

Preflop: Hero is Button with T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls $1, 2 folds, Hero calls $1, SB completes, BB checks,

Flop: ($4) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets $4, Hero raises to $10, SB folds, BB folds, UTG calls $6.

Turn: ($24) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets $15, Hero calls $15.

River: ($54) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets $38.75 (All-In), Hero calls $38.75.

Final Pot: $131.50
Main Pot: $131.50, between UTG and Hero.

nrinker · #2 09-02-2004, 11:32 PM

I wouldnt know if you were or not either, maybe if you said the guy had a history of not bluffing and straight forward play we could assume that most likely you are. I am surprised you would want to blow your whole stack on this type of situation.

xhobbes · #3 09-02-2004, 11:45 PM

I don't have a lot of experience so maybe what I'll say is not 100% ok, so it's just my opinion :

He wasn't trying to steal the pot, he has a made hand. UTG and betting the pot usually means that imo.
No PFR, you can assume he don't have an over pair, at least not QQ, KK, AA.. Maybe JJ?

I don't know how he play normally, but if I don't know someone and he plays like that, it really smells like trips to me in that situation. He bet the pot, he cold call your big raise, he bets a good amount on the turn. He's not trying to bluff you out of the pot. He really got something and that's probably better than tptk (except if this player is just a maniac or really loose aggressive but I'm saying how I would play against an unknow player). So I fold after the turn bet in that situation.

SpiderMnkE · #4 09-03-2004, 12:32 AM

He had K6o and MHIG

I am having this type of play happen to me all the time at the $50 game.

I don't know if it is my image. But it seems like I'm always having shots taken at me. This did not happen to me at the $25 game.

I'm not sure what it is. In this case I had position, but when I'm out of position it's been very very tough for me lately.

I'm not sure why I kept playing this one. I wasn't on tilt. I didn't have any huge read on the guy. My gut just told me that he didn't have it.

Then later I folded top pair on the river to what looked like a medium sized value bet fired into me all of a sudden. The guy showed a rivered set.

I'm either in the zone, or made two really bad plays that just happened to hold up. Probably the really bad plays... hahaha.

Both times it was just a gut feeling that I trusted. It could be some subconscious info I got from watching the tables... not sure.

Anyway, people are making these wacked out plays a lot. I feel like I'm actually folding too much to this sort of thing.

xhobbes · #5 09-03-2004, 12:50 AM

Well that's strange... Nice read ! [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Snoogins47 · #6 09-03-2004, 01:18 AM

I've noticed a really interesting thing at the NL25 I've been playing, fairly similar to this.

Somehow, river bluffs happen with a whole lot of frequency in heads up pots, and they're almost always very small.

I've caught like 6 people with their pants down in the past two days, with as little as second pair. Every single time it was a busted draw that decided to bet $5 at a $40 pot on the river for some reason.

I've also seen a really random thing happen a few times too... some sort of mis-understanding of what a value bet is maybe.. Say I've got top pair, bet, get called. Turn, bet, get called. River, they bet into me instead of checking. Another small bet. I either raise, call, etc...

And they'll turn over some pocket pair that works out to second or third pair.

Apparently they're on check call, then value betting the river? Maybe they think it's a bluff?? I dunno.

The players at these stakes blow my mind. Nice read on this hand man, keep it up!

Daann · #7 09-03-2004, 06:20 AM

Nicely done, I've been noticing the same thing recently. People calling with absolutely nothing, just to try and make you fold later on the turn or river.

Btw I always trust those gut feelings, they are usually right.

SpiderMnkE · #8 09-03-2004, 08:12 AM

I wonder where they come from. I guess I'll just chalk it up to experience or stupidity. It's just amazing that some instinctual type feeling can overcome logic and make me make a decision. It scares me, I don't like to trust it, but it seems to be right far too often to ignore.

Wayfare · #9 09-03-2004, 09:30 AM

I think that against most players this is a obviously -EV play. I am glad you won this one and are posting it to show that fact, but I do not like the calls and suggest you let the little ones go.

I think its strange to see you make lots of posts suggesting you really don't like large swings in your bankroll but then play hands like this.

It better be a damn good read.

dmk · #10 09-03-2004, 09:33 AM

When I get bet into on the turn, I'm probably folding. He bets the pot on the flop and calls your raise, then bets into you again. He could be making a play at the pot, but more often than not he has a hand that doesn't want to get checked through on the turn. I'm normally folding unless I have a read on him. If he's making a play, good for him, wait until you have a stronger hand to catch him.

FWIW, what do you do if he checks to you on the turn?