Am I a LAG?

[Chris Daddy Cool]

loose live 3/6 game with my fellow 2+2'ers sfer, bakku and bisonbison.

3 limpers to me on the button with A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]5 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. I raise? Blinds fold.

Flop: 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Checked to me. Do I bet my overcard + gutshot + backdoor flush or do I take the free pass?

[Joe Tall]

Your raise is ok. We all know it's neutral EV for the most part. If your opponents are aweful preflop/postflop players you can turn this into a positive EV play in position here.

Bet this flop, you've got plenty of room to improve but this is without reads on your opponents. Surely live you had some. If they will, call, call, call w/any piece, I may take a free card. I will also take a free card if they are more likely to fold to a turn bet it you pick up more outs/make a hand.

Peace,
Joe Tall

[brick]

I usually bet against three players. The more likely they are to fold on the turn, the more inclined I am to bet.

I would usually check against 5 or 6 players because it's much more likely to go to showdown.


Has every hand for the last 2 hours went to showdown? Sure there is a first time for everything, but I don't think this had is it. In other words, if they are very, very stubborn I like a check. (Would they call you down with J4 of hearts?)

[nothumb]

Regardless of this hand, yes, you are a LAG.

I agree with your pre-flop play. I usually bet this flop, but I often don't feel good about it later.

NT

[Louie Landale]

Not sure about the button raise. I'd bet the gut shot; but the 87 is boarderline. If it was 98 then surely the limpers have hit something (typical calling hands feature cards in the range 9-Q) but with 87 they can still fold QT.

Even so, taking the free card is a good idea against tricky folks who are going to check-raise you.

- Louie

[bakku]

I'd just like to point out that Chris is probably seen as a total LAG at the table, he raises at least once an orbit and that's putting it mildly. He will get called down if anyone has hit any piece of the flop. Also, the button posts a live blind.

[brick]

Then he should not bet this time.

[StellarWind]

My preference is to call preflop but raising is OK.

Except that if you truly have a LAG image you should not raise preflop. This is a situation where a raise might work for me but not for you because of the difference in image.

You need to bet this flop to protect your hand. You could easily have the best hand and be folding 6-out draws. A slightly better ace might fold (but this is where the image thing comes in) which is a huge gain. Raising also enhances your chances of winning by spiking a five.

[JSD]

Given that the button posts a live time charge of $3 (and thus the raise only costs CDC $3, not $6) I think this is a good raise.

I take the free card on the flop. Thats a big part of the reason you raised pre-flop, no? Also, there is NO WAY you are folding everyone, so its not a semi-bluff. And if its a value bet, its awfully thin.

[StellarWind]

[ QUOTE ]
Given that the button posts a live time charge of $3 (and thus the raise only costs CDC $3, not $6) I think this is a good raise.

[/ QUOTE ]
The button blind is not a reason to raise. It is a reason to check.

Folding a suited ace on the button with three limpers is terrible. Blind or no blind, you have to put at least $3 into this pot. The question is whether we should pay an extra $3 to raise.

If you decide to raise, the blind nearly ceases to matter. The hand will play out the same as if there was no special blind and the $3 rake came from the general pot.

If you don't raise, the blind does matter. Ask any slightly observant player before the flop whether CDC has 72o. The answer will be a firm 'no' if CDC called but 'maybe' if he checked. It's useful for your opponents to have almost no idea what you have. It's the one advantage of having to pay a blind. CDC should have a higher EV when he checks than when he calls.

Raising forfeits this advantage. Put another way, it's easier for raise to be +EV in comparision to call than for it to be +EV in comparison to check.

If you believe this decision is normally a complete tossup, the blind should tip the scales in favor of checking. My preference is to wait for a better kicker no matter what, but I can accept that a raise is OK too, even with the blind. It seems to be a matter of style and judging the table.