Why you shouldn't overbet your Top Pair

VegasVixen · #1 08-13-2004, 02:39 PM

OK, before you flame me for even staying in this hand, let me say 1- it was a mini-raise preflop, 2- I was the BB, 3- The same two cards had just kicked MY butt a few hands previously... Here goes:

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (8 handed)

Button ($14.60)
SB ($302)
Hero ($114.55)
UTG ($210.25)
UTG+1 ($642.10)
MP1 ($102.15)
MP2 ($51.10)
CO ($192.30)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 calls $2, CO calls $2, Button calls $2, SB raises to $4, Hero calls $2, MP2 calls $2, CO calls $2, Button calls $2.

Flop: ($20) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP2 bets $16, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds, Hero calls $16.
 Ok, here I calculate 15 outs (?), the remaining 9 spades, other 3 A's and other 3 6's... Bet is $16 into a $37 pot, approx. 2.3. At 15 outs I calculate 2.1 odds to make my hand. I call... I can't quite figure what he has, maybe a middle PP, maybe hit his set... either way I'm sure the straight or flush, if I hit, will beat his hand 

Turn: ($52) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets $22, Hero raises to $44, (OK this was his chance to Bail the hand...)
MP2 calls $9.10 (All-In).

River: ($127.10) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players, 1 all-in)

Results in white below: 
Hero shows 2s 4s (straight, five high).
MP2 shows As Th (two pair, aces and tens).
Outcome: Hero wins $127.10. 

Final Pot: $127.10

papawawa · #2 08-13-2004, 02:58 PM

Great, you took advantage of a weaker player's foolishness and made 50x the BB. Good boy.

btw, I think you're looking for the No Limit forum.

meep_42 · #3 08-13-2004, 02:59 PM

You want a cookie or something? :P

-d

BaronVonCP · #4 08-13-2004, 04:41 PM

How would you have played your AT?

PITTM · #5 08-13-2004, 05:08 PM

boy if only i knew how to quote posts, that was quite a gem. all of your reasons why we shouldnt flame you make no sense.

"it was a mini-raise preflop"...yep, and you had 24, congratulations, still fold.

"i was in the big blind"...yes, but it was raised and you have 24.

"The same two cards had just kicked MY butt a few hands previously"...good thing that doesnt matter at all, or else this game would be much easier.

and your main point that you shouldnt bet top pair only applies when youre playing with morons who call raises with 24. the whole reason he raised was so that garbage like your hand will fold. nice terrible play though.

rj

pudley4 · #6 08-13-2004, 05:17 PM

[ QUOTE ]
boy if only i knew how to quote posts, that was quite a gem. all of your reasons why we shouldnt flame you make no sense.

"it was a mini-raise preflop"...yep, and you had 24, congratulations, still fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Except that if the stacks were deep, and you play well, calling a miniraise with this is ok.

[ QUOTE ]

"i was in the big blind"...yes, but it was raised and you have 24.

[/ QUOTE ]

Again, not necessarily bad

[ QUOTE ]

"The same two cards had just kicked MY butt a few hands previously"...good thing that doesnt matter at all, or else this game would be much easier.

[/ QUOTE ]

agreed - this sounds like tilt.

[ QUOTE ]

and your main point that you shouldnt bet top pair only applies when youre playing with morons who call raises with 24. the whole reason he raised was so that garbage like your hand will fold. nice terrible play though.

rj

[/ QUOTE ]

Hmmm, I could have sworn the preflop raise came from the SB, and MP was the player with AT...

This hand should have been folded preflop here (poor position relative to the preflop raiser), but it's not always an automatic fold.

And why not checkraise him all-in on the flop? You're better than even money to make your flush or straight by the river, and you may just knock him off a better hand. He's the only remaining opponent, and he's only got $30 left, so you're not getting great implied odds either by just calling.