Do I push this?

[golfcchs]

Sorry its late. I meant stacks of
Hero 1200
UTG+1 1850
Button 6600
SB 1500
BB 1600

[ilikeaces]

[ QUOTE ]

Definite fold, this isnt even close. First of all you have no fold equity on the BB...that almost always hurts your EV when your hand isnt that strong. Second of all your hand just isnt that good. You have 8x the BB 2 off the button. This is a clearcut fold.

Of course the hand also makes no sense as it seems there arent 8000 chips in play, so I have no idea whats going on here. Surprised that so many people gave responses considering the fact that the numbers are all screwy. Either way I almost never just open push KQo 2 off the button with 8x the BB.

[/ QUOTE ]

Will you marry me?

[ChrisV]

Gigantic fold. I'd fold AJ as well - AQ is tricky. Curtains has already explained the reasons.

Isn't AQ an automatic push here with 8x BB, BB will call with any crap cards + FE? I'd push AQ here everytime, probably AJ too against only 4 opponents. Any thoughts on that?

[tigerite]

AQo and AJo are probably clear pushes with 8BB for me

[2callzU]

[ QUOTE ]
AQo and AJo are probably clear pushes with 8BB for me

[/ QUOTE ] No disrespect just curiosity. Just wondering why you would do this UTG with the blinds at 75/150. I would do this at one level higher with these hands but he's UTG and his stack although it's only 8X BB doesn't seem short or in desperate need of those blinds.

[ChrisV]

The major problem is that the BB is allin. Pokerstove has you 63.563% with AJ against a random hand. That means your EV against the BB assuming everyone else folds is a gain of 91 chips. Normally it's much closer to 225 chips. 91 chips is not worth risking a stack of 1200 over.

All this also holds true with AQ, which is why I said it was difficult. The difference with AQ is that you are significantly less likely to be called by an opponent who dominates you. Even so, I'd have no quarrel with anyone who wanted to fold AQ here.

There's also a strategic issue here. Picking up the 235 chips doesn't accomplish your major goal, which is to eliminate the button. If the button doubles up to 1320, the fact that you have 1435 chips rather than 1200 is not going to matter all that much. (You still won't be able to sit through 3 rounds of blinds at 100/200, for example).

[tigerite]

Ah - in the original post, I agree, in that case. However, he has since changed the chipcounts to:

Hero 1200
UTG+1 1850
Button 6600
SB 1500
BB 1600

In this case, AJ and AQ are for sure pushes for me. I think we got our wires crossed.

[ChrisV]

Oh. Heh. That's a little different.

However, that adds up to like 12,750 or something. But in that basic situation, UTG with KQ, I'd shove. I think it's close though.

[tjh]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You can survive a loss to the two tiny stacks.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's not a matter of surviving a loss to the tiny stacks. If the 2nd lowest stack beats us here, we've traded places with him. Make the low stacks make moves here, don't take an unnecessary risk by pushing this UTG. Use your chips to your advantage by being patient here. Plus you have to look at the game situation - adding 225 to your stack is not going to change the fact that you are solidly in 3rd and there are two shortstacks. What will change this dynamic is you losing this hand if you push.

I fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well stated and good reasoning. I change my opinion to fold.
Thanks 45suited for the well done response.

This forum rules.

--
tjh