11 Left in 10r - Is a fold here reasonable? - Page 3

TomHimself · #21 09-23-2005, 03:37 PM

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See one of my "beliefs" in MTT play is once I get a stack that is above average for the final table I slow down and avoid coinflips like this. (60/40 is a coinflip)

Earlier this month with the 5r I did this exact same thing, once i had about 500k in chips I slowed down, folded AK a few times. Went on to win the tournament by outplaying everyone, final table play by most players just isnt very good. Im very confident and patient in my ring play once Im not in push/fold territory.

I've only made like 6 final tables, I guess I'll learn this is wrong eventually, if it is. It worked for me..

[/ QUOTE ]you reaslly cant outplay ur oppenents when the blinds get this big. terrible laydown, you shouldnt be playing to move up the ladder and to make the final table. play 2 win

RavenJackson · #22 09-23-2005, 03:42 PM

I like the "stop and go", as there is no real downside. This guy is PC'd; however, despite the PC he may get away from a flop that missed. It gives you the opportunity to increase your FE and if he calls post-flop you are in the same position you would have been in had you pushed.

Exitonly · #23 09-23-2005, 03:47 PM

Also, you are not nearly sure you're in a coinflip...

60/40 is a estimate that is pretty nice to villain here..
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Again if he were = with you chip stack wise, and you two were running away with it.. then i'd fold and just abuse people at the FT.. you do have a point you can outplay people on the bubble and at the final table, and you dont need to race when it can knock you out, but this won't knock you out and willl make you chipleader... so.. it's a call.

Pat Southern · #24 09-23-2005, 03:48 PM

I think this thread would be a lot more interesting if hero had AT.

Edit: For those who say you can outplay people later, I agree. But a big part of outplaying them is getting your money in with the best of it, which includes getting AK allin HU at a 6 handed table. Therefore anybody who is saying wait to outplay your opponents won't actually outplay their opponents later in the tournament.

Exitonly · #25 09-23-2005, 03:48 PM

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I like the "stop and go", as there is no real downside. This guy is PC'd; however, despite the PC he may get away from a flop that missed. It gives you the opportunity to increase your FE and if he calls post-flop you are in the same position you would have been in had you pushed.

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i think i like this actually... so pretend my responses had all said this.

TomHimself · #26 09-23-2005, 03:51 PM

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[ QUOTE ]
I like the "stop and go", as there is no real downside. This guy is PC'd; however, despite the PC he may get away from a flop that missed. It gives you the opportunity to increase your FE and if he calls post-flop you are in the same position you would have been in had you pushed.

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i think i like this actually... so pretend my responses had all said this.

[/ QUOTE ]why do you want more FE when you prolly have best hand, no need to get fancy, easy push

Pat Southern · #27 09-23-2005, 03:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I like the "stop and go", as there is no real downside. This guy is PC'd; however, despite the PC he may get away from a flop that missed. It gives you the opportunity to increase your FE and if he calls post-flop you are in the same position you would have been in had you pushed.

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I hate a stop and go here, you think your opponent will feel pot commited with KQ on a T86 flop but not feel committed with 88 on a QT7 flop?

Exitonly · #28 09-23-2005, 03:53 PM

Well yea i guess that's true. But increasing your FE still sounds good, Smaller variance at this stage in a tournament can onl help.

Exitonly · #29 09-23-2005, 03:55 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I like the "stop and go", as there is no real downside. This guy is PC'd; however, despite the PC he may get away from a flop that missed. It gives you the opportunity to increase your FE and if he calls post-flop you are in the same position you would have been in had you pushed.

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I hate a stop and go here, you think your opponent will feel pot commited with KQ on a T86 flop but not feel committed with 88 on a QT7 flop?

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That's not what Stop-n-go is... they fold the KQ on that board, and they fold the 88 too... it's positives is they fold middle pairs that whiff.. negatives is they fold hands you ahve dominated that miss too (like KQ)... a stop and go might not be as +cEV here.. but i think because it has a lower variance (higher rate of winning the pot) that it will actually have a higher +EV here.

TomHimself · #30 09-23-2005, 04:00 PM

people overuse the stop n go