KK goes up against a nasty board- what's my line?

[TheRapist99]

Party Poker 2.00/4.00 Hold'em <font color="#0000FF">(10 handed)</font> link

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 folds</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">5 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">1 folds</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero caps</font>, SB calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (13.00 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, UTG+1 folds, Hero ????

No reads, 4th hand in. My gut instinct here is to raise raise raise me aggro aaaaaaaughhh but then when I think WHY to raise, I don't think it's compelling. It's likely that I am behind, I'm not going to get a better hand to fold here either.

I don't wanna fold though this pot is huge and I don't know the guy. 3 clubs isn't fun though and with an Ace, hell this is marginal.

So the correct line is to call it down unless a 4th club comes? Maybe? Yeah, I vote for that. Am I right?

[callmedonnie]

You can call down like a WA/WB line providing no more clubs fall. If he has a hand like JJ or QQ w/ club, he isn't going anywhere.

But the AK combos make me think the chances of winning this hand are really slim.

[TheRapist99]

[ QUOTE ]
You can call down like a WA/WB line providing no more clubs fall. If he has a hand like JJ or QQ w/ club, he isn't going anywhere.

But the AK combos make me think the chances of winning this hand are really slim.

[/ QUOTE ]

So you'd consider throwing this away right here?

[callmedonnie]

I'd really want to have a read. I know it sounds weak, but I would consider it. But I am really not sure if that is wise. I advocated the WA/WB line because you lose the least when you are behind. I wouldn't put in any raises because you aren't folding anything and a lot of cards hurt you, and you might already be beat.

The only instance I could see a raise is if the case King comes down and no more clubs do.

The real problem with this hand is that you have no read. If a rock lead out, yes, I think I can fold.

[TheRapist99]

[ QUOTE ]
I'd really want to have a read. I know it sounds weak, but I would consider it. But I am really not sure if that is wise. I advocated the WA/WB line because you lose the least when you are behind. I wouldn't put in any raises because you aren't folding anything and a lot of cards hurt you, and you might already be beat.

The only instance I could see a raise is if the case King comes down and no more clubs do.

The real problem with this hand is that you have no read. If a rock lead out, yes, I think I can fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

It turned out later that the guy was a maniac, 45 vpip 40 pfr... knowing that would make me more inclined to call it down. or even raise it up.

[sy_or_bust]

I would usually fold immediately, but not in this pot. Call the flop, and consider a raise/fold on a safe turn, planning to check-down or fold a club river. Otherwise, without a read, call until the 4th club, sure.

[sean c]

The pot really isn't that big. If sb bets every street and you call your going to have to be good 1 in 6 for it to be the correct play. Your almost never folding a better hand and if your behind you have like zero outs. I would probably fold. Against a known opponent with position it might change but here I probably fold or call the flop bet and see if he fires again on the turn and decide from there.

Ugh. Great hand to think about, glad I'm not the one playing it. If he has AK, he either has the K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] or K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].

Do you have a read on SB? Will he cap with AK off (or even AQ) when he's out of position? If not, then the K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] is out of the picture and his most likely holdings are A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], AA, QQ, JJ, TT or the other KK.

If this is the range of hands I put him on, I'm ahead right now more often than not. Call flop, raise non-club turn? Call flop, raise club turn? Raise flop? I want to hear some ideas...

I think I call flop and raise a non-club turn...

[Rduke55]

[ QUOTE ]
Ugh. Great hand to think about, glad I'm not the one playing it. If he has AK, he either has the K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] or K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].

Do you have a read on SB? Will he cap with AK off (or even AQ) when he's out of position? If not, then the K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] is out of the picture and his most likely holdings are A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], AA, QQ, JJ, TT or the other KK.

If this is the range of hands I put him on, I'm ahead right now more often than not. Call flop, raise non-club turn? Call flop, raise club turn? Raise flop? I want to hear some ideas...

I think I call flop and raise a non-club turn...

[/ QUOTE ]

With it capped PF I do like the idea he's got a pair with a club.

[TheRapist99]

[ QUOTE ]

With it capped PF I do like the idea he's got a pair with a club.

[/ QUOTE ]

KJo, with the Jack of Clubs.

Not kidding.