How would you have played this?

[amoeba]

fair enough. it works better when there isn't anybody behind you to call with you and draw to something better, reraise preflop and force you to fold, etc...

you also can't get folding equity against PFR should he flop missed overs because there is somebody to act behind you.

This is a tough hand. The general rule is slow down when the board is paired, but in a raised pot and that flop, it's hard to put someone on a made full house on the flop.

That six on the turn made your straight, but put a credible full house on the board, too, so I am pretty sure I would not have raised at that point. Gutless? maybe. I don't know. I am interested in seeing what the others have had to say about this hand.

I have played against Machine0 (and zero_point), however. Without saying anything in more detail, I think that specific player being in this hand complicates the analysis, and, for that reason, I am not going to say it was wrong to raise.

Tough situation. I guess my spineless self tries to get from the turn to the river as cheaply as possible.

[djoyce003]

it's a marginal preflop call but that's been covered. If you were wanting to take the pot down on the turn, the correct move was to open push the turn. As it was they basically have to call with a flush draw because they've each put in 15 and it's only 30 more to them...and a flush draw is likely all that they could have that beats you. Someone might have a naked 3, which also kills you on that river. Your hand doesn't look like the full house because anybody with a full house wouldn't push the turn because they don't care if a flush hits, in fact they are praying for a flush to hit. You basically let them know what your hand was and that it was still ok to draw out on you, and you gave them the odds to do so. Open push the turn.

[msb]

I'll concede the pre-flop call in that position was a little iffy... especially with enough hands behind me to make the post-flop play problematic (as this very hand demonstrates!)

And I think I agree that my move should have probably been to open-push on the turn. I had him on either a flush draw or a three after the flop raise and I would normally have played this a little faster, I gambled a little that he would bet (and not take the free card) and I was going to check-raise him (and then hope a diamond doesn't come... or the board pairs).

I now realize that this was asking for trouble.

As it turned out, the EP had the AA that I thought he did, but the button had 22 and I was drawing dead by the turn anyway.

[punter11235]

Preflop is not significant here, c'mon its only 2$ it cant be big mistake.
I would fold on the flop. You dont know how many (if any) outs you have and the chances that you will stack anybody if you hit are very slim. Clear fold.

Best wishes

[kingofswing]

fold preflop...what if its raised later? maybe call in LP, definitely not in MP. open push turn. anyone that's saying a raise here will call an open push.

you got lucky, don't expect to do it again.

[Godfather80]

[ QUOTE ]
Preflop is not significant here, c'mon its only 2$ it cant be big mistake.
I would fold on the flop. You dont know how many (if any) outs you have and the chances that you will stack anybody if you hit are very slim. Clear fold.

Best wishes

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. The $2 investment preflop is a mistake in your position only because players behind you may force you out of the hand (or force you to re-invest) with a reraise.

Given that, I dislike the flop play more. You invested preflop to hit a monster flop on occasion against a big hand and stack that hand. You missed.

[kingofswing]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Preflop is not significant here, c'mon its only 2$ it cant be big mistake.
I would fold on the flop. You dont know how many (if any) outs you have and the chances that you will stack anybody if you hit are very slim. Clear fold.

Best wishes

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. The $2 investment preflop is a mistake in your position only because players behind you may force you out of the hand (or force you to re-invest) with a reraise.

Given that, I dislike the flop play more. You invested preflop to hit a monster flop on occasion against a big hand and stack that hand. You missed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Reinvest? Implied odds only go so far. Someone raises to $6 you're going to call, but I really don't like it.

Also, on a completely different note, in the situation that unfolded, remember that if someone has AA (not probably, but possible) then you lose 4 outs. Now you have an inside straight draw. You going to draw to that?

[Godfather80]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Preflop is not significant here, c'mon its only 2$ it cant be big mistake.
I would fold on the flop. You dont know how many (if any) outs you have and the chances that you will stack anybody if you hit are very slim. Clear fold.

Best wishes

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. The $2 investment preflop is a mistake in your position only because players behind you may force you out of the hand (or force you to re-invest) with a reraise.

Given that, I dislike the flop play more. You invested preflop to hit a monster flop on occasion against a big hand and stack that hand. You missed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Reinvest? Implied odds only go so far. Someone raises to $6 you're going to call, but I really don't like it.

Also, on a completely different note, in the situation that unfolded, remember that if someone has AA (not probably, but possible) then you lose 4 outs. Now you have an inside straight draw. You going to draw to that?

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. That's why I said it was a mistake. Drawing on that flop is a poor play.

[msb]

[ QUOTE ]
Given that, I dislike the flop play more. You invested preflop to hit a monster flop on occasion against a big hand and stack that hand. You missed.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. I wasn't looking to flop a draw, I was looking to flop a monster (i.e. made straight, trips, etc..). I should have folded.

An additional mistake was not looking forward to what might actually happen even if I were to hit my straight... would I have the nuts? What do I do if the button raises? What if EP pushes? etc... I was only concentrating on my draw.