77 river decision

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This is a very loose table, so any pair from any position has good implied odds to play, I believe. Even if someone raises behind you, you can expect at least 1 or 2 cold callers, and one of the blinds defending.

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This is true. At a passive, fishy table, I too limp in with small pocket pairs. But the whole "implied odds" aspect of it assumes that you know how to play them postflop. Our hero here took his hand too far, and if he plays 77 like this every time, it's going to cost him a lot of money.

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I think this was a WA/WB scenario. The only obvious hand sticking around that beats him is a higher pair, Kx. So, he found out on the river that he was behind. I would play it the same, except bet/fold on the river.

[aargh57]

In defense of keetz,

I think that you've made some good points even though I don't agree with them all (especially this last, TPNK here is raise or fold IMO). Sorry about the LOL at Krieger thing the first HE book I bought too but he's not considered a great writer around here. I don't want you to get discouraged here because we can all benefit from each other.

[DMBFan23]

on the river, it's always way ahead (you have the best hand) or way behind (you don't) [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[aargh57]

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on the river, it's always way ahead (you have the best hand) or way behind (you don't) [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

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Damn, Eureka!!! [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

[keetz555]

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Sorry about the LOL at Krieger thing the first HE book I bought too but he's not considered a great writer around here. I don't want you to get discouraged here because we can all benefit from each other.

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Okay, I didn't know that. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] But I really like the articles he writes for Card Player. I haven't bought any of his books, so I can't comment on that.

Yeah, no point in catching hard feelings here. I like discussions like these. They make us think hard about the game we love and help us develop.

Peace

[Shillx]

An aggression factor of 0.9 on a villain with a VPIP of 49 is fairly high.

AF has little meaning when you don't take WTSD into account. It is very easy to have a VPIP of 100% and an AF of 3.0 (for example). I limp in with 42o and don't get involved unless I flop something good. If I hit 2-pair or more I go nuts and if not I check/fold. So someone with a high VPIP, high aggro and low WTSD is weak/loose. Someone with stats like 100/15/3/100 WTSD would be a flat out maniac.

Brad

[aargh57]

More on the subject of AF

[@bsolute_luck]

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Are you deliberately trying to be argumentative?

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What? I'm just saying that MP3 should raise with a king if he has one. Do you disagree?

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i just ask you to think about it. what are you scared of on this flop? if you're villain and hero has trips, you're only getting 3-bet, but you're not sure he DOES have trips, so you're calling down. if you have K6 and hero is betting into, you're only losing to a stronger King. but if hero is bluffing or a smaller pocket, you would simply fold a weaker hand that would keep betting into you.

plus the best play on the river, again is to just call. raising here would only fold him, so you should only raise a busted draw or like a 99 or 88- make sense? that's for us to think about.

ABC players would normally raise a K on the flop when there is no point because you're only folding hands drawing dead or very slim.

[Aaron W.]

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Are you deliberately trying to be argumentative?

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What? I'm just saying that MP3 should raise with a king if he has one. Do you disagree?

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It's not a matter of agree/disagree. If you're going to assert that a certain play is better, it's important that you make an argument for it.

I'm not picking on you in particular, but the parts of the thread which I've browsed simply seem to be full of blind assertions. When there is this much back and forth, it should really be because there's a debate brewing. This thread is about 20 posts too long because of the content-less posts.

I think betting the flop here is pretty close. In a 5 handed pot like this I might let it go. I like the turn bet b/c of the description of the remaining villian. Once we get to the river I think the pot is small enough to make it a bet/fold. If we're not willing to fold to the river raise, then I check/call and hope to induce a bluff from a worse hand.