Lack of Patriot Act hurts the UK

[bobman0330]

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the point is the UK government interferes with the lives of UK citizens far less than the US government does with US citizens, we never had a Guantanamo, you had to have done something wrong to be arrested until recently, we don't do death penalty anymore (too many innocent people murdered by the state). I like the philosophy behind life in the USA, but its changing now, and not for the better, people need to look at whats happeneing and really think if its good for freedom and fairness.


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Glad to have some pretentious blather from our overseas pals about the state of affairs in our country.

Firstly, it's funny to me that none of you are even trying to pretend that you aren't grossly mischaracterizing the Patriot Act.

Secondly, "[YOU] NEVER HAD A GUANTANAMO"?? You mean you personally?? This claim merely shows your ignorance and desire to claim moral superiority, not anything about the truth. In fact, until the House of Lords found it illegal, many foreign nationals living in the UK (compare with enemy combatants captured in the field of battle) were detained on suspicion, without any sort of trial, indefinitely. They were given the option of being deported to their home countries as their only out. Of course, this was less of an out, since the reason they weren't deported in the first place was that they were so likely to be tortured or otherwise abused in their home countries that it was illegal under UK law to deport them.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4100481.stm

But at least you never stained your moral purity by interning enemy soldiers during a war. (Recently. Read about the Boer War concentration camps [actually, mostly civilians, not soldiers] if you're into history.)

And a little Euro-snobbishness about the death penalty. Good post, bud.

[MMMMMM]

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Sures it's important to prevent unnecessary suffering and deaths, but you are right, there are much bigger killers, and things that affect peoples daily lives much more than terrorism.

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This definitely won't true be if terrorists acquire nukes and the means to use them.

[mackthefork]

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the point is the UK government interferes with the lives of UK citizens far less than the US government does with US citizens, we never had a Guantanamo, you had to have done something wrong to be arrested until recently, we don't do death penalty anymore (too many innocent people murdered by the state). I like the philosophy behind life in the USA, but its changing now, and not for the better, people need to look at whats happeneing and really think if its good for freedom and fairness.



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Glad to have some pretentious blather from our overseas pals about the state of affairs in our country.

Firstly, it's funny to me that none of you are even trying to pretend that you aren't grossly mischaracterizing the Patriot Act.

Secondly, "[YOU] NEVER HAD A GUANTANAMO"?? You mean you personally?? This claim merely shows your ignorance and desire to claim moral superiority, not anything about the truth. In fact, until the House of Lords found it illegal, many foreign nationals living in the UK (compare with enemy combatants captured in the field of battle) were detained on suspicion, without any sort of trial, indefinitely. They were given the option of being deported to their home countries as their only out. Of course, this was less of an out, since the reason they weren't deported in the first place was that they were so likely to be tortured or otherwise abused in their home countries that it was illegal under UK law to deport them.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4100481.stm

But at least you never stained your moral purity by interning enemy soldiers during a war. (Recently. Read about the Boer War concentration camps [actually, mostly civilians, not soldiers] if you're in to history.)

And a little Euro-snobbishness about the death penalty. Good post, bud.

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As usual you come on all high and mighty, putting words in my mouth and scrambling up the meaning of the very words you are quoting.

Firstly this thread is full of ignorant bullshit about Europe, I'm happy with the comparisons I made.

What I have clearly said, is we never had a Guantanamo type situation (detention without charge) now we do, and its not a good thing in my opinion.

Secondly you are talking about the Patriot act, I am talking about the proposed legislation the UK government would like to put through the House of Lords, I know quite well what measures are being discussed, you are of course right, I am not aware of what the Patriot Act does.

Why are you talking about the death penalty, I was mistaken to raise it, but its looked on very poorly over here, draw up a list of countries that still have it and you'll see why.

We all know that every countries military almost without exception has commited attrocities, its not big and its not clever, just because we did it a 100 years ago, doesn't make it okay for the US and allies to do it now.

Regards Mack (not on the moral high ground)

[mackthefork]

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Quote:
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Sures it's important to prevent unnecessary suffering and deaths, but you are right, there are much bigger killers, and things that affect peoples daily lives much more than terrorism.


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This definitely won't true be if terrorists acquire nukes and the means to use them.

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Lets hope it never happens.

Mack