Intimidated by 5/10? (LC) - Page 4

#31 10-28-2005, 01:07 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Taken from here....

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 1 fold, MP1 calls, 3 folds, Button calls, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, UTG checks, MP1 checks, Button bets, SB calls, Hero calls, UTG folds, MP1 calls.

Turn: (4.50 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP1 checks, Button bets, SB folds, Hero raises, MP1 folds, Button calls.

River: (8.50 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets, Button calls.

Final Pot: 10.50 BB

Results below:
Hero has 5d Qc (two pair, fives and fours).
Button has 2s 2d (two pair, fours and threes).
Outcome: Hero wins 10.50 BB.

[/ QUOTE ]

ROFL, take me to this game! Can't believe this is 5/10!

Perseus · #32 10-28-2005, 02:35 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Taken from here....

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 1 fold, MP1 calls, 3 folds, Button calls, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, UTG checks, MP1 checks, Button bets, SB calls, Hero calls, UTG folds, MP1 calls.

Turn: (4.50 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP1 checks, Button bets, SB folds, Hero raises, MP1 folds, Button calls.

River: (8.50 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets, Button calls.

Final Pot: 10.50 BB

Results below:
Hero has 5d Qc (two pair, fives and fours).
Button has 2s 2d (two pair, fours and threes).
Outcome: Hero wins 10.50 BB.

[/ QUOTE ]

nh

Nick Royale · #33 10-28-2005, 02:40 PM

[ QUOTE ]
1) The 1/3 blind structure leads to a tighter game since the SB has very little incentive to play, and since there is less $$ on the table at the start of every hand.

2) The 3/6 and up have 6-max tables that suck away many of the loose, action-loving players, so the full tables are generally tighter.

[/ QUOTE ]
I like number two more than number one. Loose players don't care too much about how big the SB is.

I agree that there's more tight tables at 3/6, but with a decent tableselection you can find plenty of tables not far from 2/4-standard. Maybe my good tableselection didn't made me realise the differances between 2/4 and 3/6.

krimson · #34 10-28-2005, 02:47 PM

Funny hand, but this is a pretty reasonable error to make if someone is multi-tabling / not paying much attention. He probably decided to call down to showdown on the turn and didn't think about the river.

Nick Royale · #35 10-28-2005, 02:48 PM

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true, as a tennis player I play terribly against poor opponents and better than normal against good opponents - I'm sure this can be applied to poker as well. Maybe I should get back into the party cash games and take a few beatings to try and improve.

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Agreed. I lose focus against poor tennis players and poor poker players.

BigBrother · #36 10-28-2005, 03:06 PM

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I agree that there's more tight tables at 3/6, but with a decent tableselection you can find plenty of tables not far from 2/4-standard. Maybe my good tableselection didn't made me realise the differances between 2/4 and 3/6.

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I have played a lot of both recently. I practice table selection very aggressively. The main differences I find are:

1) Plenty of 2/4 tables with an avg VPIP > 30, pfr < 8, and pfAgg < 1.4 just about any time of day. 3/6 tables are generally VPIP > 28, pfr < 9, and pfAgg significantly higher than at 2/4,typically around 1.7.

2) A higher frequency of completely 'erratic' play at 2/4

3) Getting raised on the turn 'usually' means something more at 3/6 (and up) than at 2/4.

4) The average 3/6 (and up) player will usually extract more value from me when they make a good hand that beats me. You probably don't experience this because you are probably a better player than I.

Nick Royale · #37 10-28-2005, 08:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I agree that there's more tight tables at 3/6, but with a decent tableselection you can find plenty of tables not far from 2/4-standard. Maybe my good tableselection didn't made me realise the differances between 2/4 and 3/6.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have played a lot of both recently. I practice table selection very aggressively. The main differences I find are:

1) Plenty of 2/4 tables with an avg VPIP > 30, pfr < 8, and pfAgg < 1.4 just about any time of day. 3/6 tables are generally VPIP > 28, pfr < 9, and pfAgg significantly higher than at 2/4,typically around 1.7.

2) A higher frequency of completely 'erratic' play at 2/4

3) Getting raised on the turn 'usually' means something more at 3/6 (and up) than at 2/4.

4) The average 3/6 (and up) player will usually extract more value from me when they make a good hand that beats me. You probably don't experience this because you are probably a better player than I.

[/ QUOTE ]
I agree about 1 and 4 (they extract more value from me too), but not 2 and 3. Players get trickier at higher limits and unfortunately they get trickier in situation where I have a marginal hand.

About turn raises, they become more frequent as move up and they're often semibluffs or a raise for free sd. I think you need to call down turn raises more frequently on 5/10 than 2/4.

#38 10-28-2005, 08:22 PM

that hand made me laugh out loud at work.

I am never leaving that table.

Thanks for that post.

#39 10-28-2005, 08:29 PM

I do the same playing tennis. My problem is that I don't have to play my best to win, so I don't focus.

A mental trick that works for me is to change my goal from just winning, to destroying my opponent and hitting the shower.

This helps my game, but I agree that you need to play better opponents to improve.

gh9801 · #40 10-28-2005, 08:39 PM

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Don’t be. I have had no trouble finding 4-6 tables looking like this:

I think that if you’re comfortable playing 3/6 and have the bankroll for 5/10 you should move up. That is if your poker ambition is to improve your game, earn money and move up in limits. You should be aware that 5/10 is a more aggressive game (for example average pfr at the tables are often ~10%). Players tend to get tricky and you’ll often be facing marginal situations heads up, but I think it’s clear these games are beatable for a high winrate even while multitabling. If you’re a decent, but far from perfect, poker player like me, you should be able to beat 5/10 full for more than 2BB/100 longterm. This is very reachable even playing 4 tables if you’re used to multitable IMO. These are estimations I made by judging from the tables and not my own winrate. When I played yesterday I got called down by A and K-high hands at least 8 times in situation where the action earlier in the hand made it clear they were beat and also most often should have folded on the earlier streets (probably more than that since I don’t always pay attention to what people were calling down with while playing 4-6 tables). As you all know, table selection is the key.

Good luck!

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5/10 is the hardest game ever. I don't know why you're encouraging everyone to join us in this impossible grind.

On a side note..... has anyone noticed how 5/10 has gotten fishier since the skins breakup? I don't know how this makes sense, but I seem to be finding more fish.