Not Optimum: Hand 2

[naphand]

I do not know if he is LAG, with only 50 hands the only thing I am sure of is that he is very aggressive. I do agree that against a known LAG, you have to be prepared to give a lot of action and sometimes/regularly get stung.

There was a lot on the post the chew on, and the small sample size for the PT data was one thing that made me cautious to label him. I have played over 100K of SH up to $5/$10 I have seen plenty of crazy plays: this a question of where to draw the line and small sample sizes should mean drawing the line sooner. Leaping in and saying "cap all streets" is OK, but it is just an opinion. I happen to value opinions supported by analysis just that little bit more.

I actually never said you played with ego, my refernce was to the nature of your post, which could easily be called "truculent" in its nature, not the kind of insight I was seeking.

[ QUOTE ]
Chief agreed with me; that should tell you something.

[/ QUOTE ]

As a recent arrival to small stakes, I am not familiar with your pecking order, maybe I should be but I tend to judge posts on their content. He also said in one post "I'm capping all streets" and in another "I still at least cap the Turn" so there IS room for some strategical manouvre here, the discussion of which was the purpose of the post.

As for the hand-reading posts, gawd do you have to bring it up again? The nihilistic reactions of a few poisonous individuals have put me off bothering with it so, well done, if that was your aim. At least my little tester post achieved its purpose. Similar posts (by stripsqueez) ran for months in the HUSH forum. The people there happily took them for what they were - a harmless piece of fun with the chance of some free $$. The screeching that went off here is almost comical, certainly very sad; if you guys really cannot stomach NOT being able to demonstrate how much more you know because the hands are unreadable, that is your problem. Get over it for jings crivvens sake, I thought the subject had died already.

Click here and take a look for yourself.

I do not have a problem with people making sarcastic remarks, or having a bit of fun, but if you want to snipe at me expect some return fire... [img]/images/graemlins/ooo.gif[/img]

[naphand]

Do you believe this player caps the flop with AT?

This really boils down to what constitues likely play, and whether we can really define this player as a LAG after just 50 hands and no previous blind encounters to go on.

If I knew for certain this player was a LAG, then capping through seems pretty easy.

[krishanleong]

As a HUSHer I'm going to step into the ring and vouch for Naphand as a valuable poster. Good insight and a thirst for better play. Sfer and Chief are also very good. Pretend you two didn't argue.

I cap the turn and go 2-3 on the river.

Krishan

[ErrantNight]

it's not about pecking order... it's about people who know their sh it. if you don't know who those people are... well, hang around, you'll learn.

but just because you offer a detailed post and detailed reads and put in the requisite effort it does not always mean that a lengthy, detailed answer is justified or required to answer your question.

if anything, dave's point was made much more clear by its succinct nature, and you're being defensive. you're overthinking this hand to some extent... no one with a lick of intelligence is saying jam all pots all the time when you flop a set. here, the conditions make it pretty clear that that's the appropriate line.

Further... it's not unreasonable to expect if you're posting in the SSHE forum that you know who chief and sfer (and a whole host of other capable people) are and have some understanding of their level of play and capacity for analysis.

Not that they need defending from me.

[naphand]

[ QUOTE ]
the conditions make it pretty clear that that's the appropriate line.

[/ QUOTE ]

The conditions being?

In a SH game I have no doubts about capping this through against all except the most rockesque players. In the $2/$4 and $3/$6 FULL games I have rarely seen capping on two successive streets with less than the nuts (fish/LAGs playing flushes a notable exception). I have seen plenty of odd and random play, but I feel I need more of a read to auto-cap this thro against a player I have only 50 hands on, and no previous blind-stealing encounters?

[ QUOTE ]
you're overthinking this hand to some extent...

[/ QUOTE ]

It is one of my difficulties, but being able to discriminate the finer points helps in future slightly different situations.

Getting back to the point of the post...

This is a fairly straightforward hand but, given the limited info on opponent, I am merely asking if capping through really should be automatic and if NOT then where do we draw the line and why? That is why my OP contains the lines "More straightforward..." and "Cap it through?". I think some people have assumed I threw the towel in... [img]/images/graemlins/ooo.gif[/img]

[chief444]

I had an opponent cap a similar flop with a 4-high, no draw except backdoor flush the other day. Opponents often do unusual things in these situations. I see them overplaying A-high a lot of the time.

I think the combination of the fact that AK doesn't slow down here meaning you're 50/50 even if the read is off and the fact that the opponent has appeared Laggy over the 50 hands (although, yes certainly it's not a big sample) and the fact that opponents generally overplay hands in this situation means you don't win as much if you slow down here.

[sfer]

[ QUOTE ]
I do not know if he is LAG, with only 50 hands the only thing I am sure of is that he is very aggressive. I do agree that against a known LAG, you have to be prepared to give a lot of action and sometimes/regularly get stung.


[/ QUOTE ]

Reread your hand. You wrote "is a 30/20 LAG" not "might be LAG." If you're going to give a read I'm going to assume it's right.

[ QUOTE ]
As a recent arrival to small stakes, I am not familiar with your pecking order, maybe I should be but I tend to judge posts on their content. He also said in one post "I'm capping all streets" and in another "I still at least cap the Turn" so there IS room for some strategical manouvre here, the discussion of which was the purpose of the post.

[/ QUOTE ]

I told you to grow a pair and cap. I tend to select my words carefully. I stand by that post and it is entirely consistent with the longer post I gave afterward. You should consider that I put more thought into the first post than you gave me credit.

[PTjvs]

[ QUOTE ]
no one with a lick of intelligence is saying jam all pots all the time when you flop a set.

[/ QUOTE ]

You could do much worse than jamming all pots all the time when you flop a set at 2/4 & 3/6, especially HU.

jvs

[naphand]

OK, fair enough I apologise if I offended but you will have to believe me when I say I have no difficulty finding the raise button...usually. I am guilty of over-anlaysing.

[ QUOTE ]
SB is a 30/20 LAG

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn...you are right. That was dumb, it should have read may be LAG. I did not have any table read to suggest he was out-of-line on a regular basis. My mistake, and I accept your response based on this.