Interesting KJo hand level 3 $109

[citanul]

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what in the blue hell are you doing in this forum?

you, nick, and curtains have already handled all the actual stuff that needs to be said here, so i'll just leave my commentary to "wtf are you doing here?"

citanul

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Someone told me this was the forum with the worst strategy advice in twoplustwo. I was thinking, NO WAY! So I decided to check it out. Sadly, he was correct.
-James

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well i'm sorry that you came to agree with that person.

i honestly think that some of the best strategy discussions happen here, but they are often buried in huge heaping piles of trash.

sadly, the same is sort of how i feel about mid/high stakes (nl or limit) and the shorthanded forum.

i don't know if you have any interest in learning sngs or discussing them, but if you stick around a while, maybe we'll change your mind or something.

citanul

[curtains]

I should get out to the other forums more, whenever someone new comes to this forum and everyone freaks out, I never have any idea who they are.

[citanul]

also, james, you haven't been around much, but you should know that amongst the better things that have occured in the sng strategy discussions lately are various threads detailing that particularly late in the game, no matter what kind of range you put your opponent on, you shouldn't be opening up your calling standards basically at all. (nice long sentence there, but i think it makes sense.) when it comes down to it basically the whole reason people came up with for callign at all late in game has nothing to do with what you think that a person might be pushing with at that moment, but instead only about inter-game image plays and spite calls, basically knowingly giving up some ev and into some variance in order to get yourself some easier bubble play in future games with thinking opponents.

additionally, if i felt that raising a couple hands early in the tournament made it even 2% more likely that i was going to get called when i push later in the game, i would raise 0% of hands early in the game.

citanul

[citanul]

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I should get out to the other forums more, whenever someone new comes to this forum and everyone freaks out, I never have any idea who they are.

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haha, yeah, i do a fair amount of reading of the other forums. mostly that time, as most time spent reading poker forums, is wasted. but sometimes there's something worthwhile.

citanul

[Newt_Buggs]

I was merely trying to explain that if raising frequently makes your opponents play looser against you, then every individual raise must be making your opponents a little bit looser (although there is now way that this is a linear effect where every raise has an equal effect). Yes, many times your raise will go completely unoticed, but what if the BB makes a tough decision and lays down a decent hand here? He will certainly remember it and may be slightly more inclined to call a futures steal. If you think that my logic is flawed please help me figure out where I have made a mistake.

btw, I raise KJ often here too, but there are some cases against a manical BB where I would rather lay this down than commit 400 chips to a raise and continuation bet.

[jeffraider]

I wonder if the preflop play isn't just a matter of being level-specific. In the $22s I fold preflop because the typical BB will call with a lot of hands and KJo is fairly weak, and I honestly don't care about getting the t75 when I'm sitting on 2000 chips. Of course, one of the reasons I don't care is because I know that by playing tight here I'm giving my weak opponents more chances to knock each other out and saving my chips for where my opponents REALLY play poorly, levels 4-6. I think against better players I would want to play it for a raise here because it is a decent hand in position against opponents who are not going to do me the favour of going nuts anytime soon.

[James282]

Hey Citanul - I don't doubt that you guys have some great strategy discussions. I didn't mean to make a broad, sweeping generalization about a whole forum, and for that I apologize for any implied offense. I just think that a lot of the awful advice goes unpoliced and really detracts from the good advice. Look at that thread where the guy has 88 UTG with 6 left. Some of the advice is non-debatably embarassing, but it goes unaddressed. You clearly understand what you are talking about and I wouldn't even doubt that you are a better SnG player than I am, but that doesn't mean that the overall quality of advice is very good. On the other hand, I should read a little more before I render a judgment, which I will, but I suppose I just expected that this forum would have a feel like the mid-high forum where the top players do a bit of moderation when plainly bad or misleading advice is put forth.
-James

[curtains]

I can't find the 88 hand? I like to police, but sometimes I feel like I'm being mean!!!

[curtains]

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Hey Citanul - I don't doubt that you guys have some great strategy discussions. I didn't mean to make a broad, sweeping generalization about a whole forum, and for that I apologize for any implied offense. I just think that a lot of the awful advice goes unpoliced and really detracts from the good advice. Look at that thread where the guy has 88 UTG with 6 left. Some of the advice is non-debatably embarassing, but it goes unaddressed. You clearly understand what you are talking about and I wouldn't even doubt that you are a better SnG player than I am, but that doesn't mean that the overall quality of advice is very good. On the other hand, I should read a little more before I render a judgment, which I will, but I suppose I just expected that this forum would have a feel like the mid-high forum where the top players do a bit of moderation when plainly bad or misleading advice is put forth.
-James

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James, stick around this forum, we need more people who can tell the difference between good and bad advice and aren't afraid to speak up!