Warning - Ladbrokes Poker

[cuwdrapoes]

Hi there, im new around here (new to posting, been reading and using the great advice on here for a few months now) and thought i would warn you all of playing on Ladbrokes' Poker Site.

About 3 weeks ago i was playin on a 1$/2$ and a 2$/5$ Hold em No Limit Tables. I usually potter around with a few hundred in my account, not a big layer, mostly tournaments and stuff and some low stakes cash tables. Well this one saturday morning i played for about an hour and in that time i came across some very stupid players (or in my opinion one player with multiple accounts who went on tilt really bad) and i turned £100 into around £1800 ! The state of play went roughly like this, id call or raise slightly, hed come right over the top with a big raise, about half his stack usually, this happened EVERY hand, so i smelt a bluff merchant and i had pretty good cards for heads up play so i came right back at him over the top re-raising his re-raise, hence either moving him off the hand or inducing a call and beating him on the table.
Without doubt the biggest win ive ever had online and as you can guess i was absolutley cock a hoop with such a big win. However the money never reached my account, which started off a chain of phone call after phone call etc etc until the last few days where things seem to have come to a head via emails with Ladbrokes "customer" services, which i post below----------------------------------------------------------------

From: "imail@ladbrokes.com" <imail@ladbrokes.com>
>Reply-To: "imail@ladbrokes.com" <imail@ladbrokes.com>
>To: ------ ----- <**********@hotmail.com>
>Subject: Re: Your Account
>Date: Sun, 20 Jun 2004 13:56:29 +0100
>
>Dear Mr -----,
>
>Thank you for your e-mail.
>
>We do apologise for the confusion caused to you in this matter, but
>currently our security department are carrying out a standard
>investigation and would be grateful if you could supply the following
>documents:
>
>1)Copy of passport
>2)Latest bank statement showing both name and address
>3)Copy of front and back of registered bank card
>
>Please either email the above to Documents@Ladbrokescasino.com or
>alternatively fax them accross to fax no:00 350 40491.
>
>Once our security department receive these documents, they will advise
>you of the re-activation of your account.
>
>We look forward to hearing from you.
>
>Kind regards,
>
>David
>Customer Services


================================================== =======================================


RE - Suspended Accounts - --------- / ------ / -------

Further too numerous attempts to resolve this matter via telephone over
the
last 3 weeks or so, i am writing to verify the status of the
"investigation"
into the suspension of my account.

As you can probably understand 3 weeks is an awful long time and i am
very
disapointed with the level of customer service and support i have
received
regarding this matter.

I have been a ladbrokes casino customer for nearly 4 years and to be
frank i
am disgusted by my recent treatment and the inconvenience caused to me.
I
have had accounts suspended one after another for no reason at all, and
when
i call your helplines i get told to just open a new account with a
slightly
different user name etc etc ! This now means i have 3 accounts on 3
different bank cards ALL suspended with funds approaching 2000 pounds in

them, as well as not being able to log into Ladbrokes Poker, Casino or
even
your sports betting website.

I have spoken to a Mr Ken Mackie from your Poker security department who

informed me that my account was suspended due to "suspicions of
chip-dumping" from the players i played against. Well strike me down
with a
feather but what has that to do with me if i come across loose players?

Do you suspend everyones account who wins on your site? It does seem
strange
that ive had losing accounts with Ladbrokes for nearly 4 years and as
soon
as i turn a profit im suspended!
I gave Mr Mackie my personal mobile telephone number over 3 weeks ago,
who
assured me he would be in touch very soon to update me of the situation.
I
have heard nothing depsite my repeated attempts to get in touch.

Absolutely incredulous is what it is, nothing short of a scandal
especially
at a time when your company is pushing its poker site hard through
advertising with the Poker Million event and advertising on Sky and in
The
Racing Post, which is all geared to attracting new customers. Well if
you
treat a loyal and longstanding customer such as myself like you have, i
certainly feel sorry for any new customers you attract.

Im afraid if this matter is not resolved in the next couple of days i
will
be forced to pursue this matter further, and seek legal recourse for
recovery of all outstanding monies owed to me.

I have already involved IBAS through copying them into this email, and
will
be following up by submitting a formal complaint to them regarding this
incident.

I look forward to hearing from you soon

Regards

----- -----

================================================== ======================================

From: "poker@ladbrokescasino.com" <poker@ladbrokescasino.com>
Reply-To: "poker@ladbrokescasino.com" <poker@ladbrokescasino.com>
To: ********
Subject: Re: Re: Your Account
Date: Fri, 09 Jul 2004 18:38:20 +0100

Dear ------,

Thank you for your e-mail.

I can confirm that your account will remain suspended as we belive that
you have carried out fraudulent activity by recieving chips from other
players in means other than normal poker activity, we are still
investigating this matter and will contact you in due course if it will
be at all possible to re-activate your account again.

Please feel free take this matter up with who you feel necessary, I am
sure you can appreciate that these actions are in place to protect our
customer from fraudulent activity.

If we can be of any further assistance, please do not hesitate to
contact us again.

Kind regards,

Sandy Jackson-Palin
Ladbrokes Multi Player Poker

================================================== ============================

Dear Sandy,

Many thanks for the swiftness of your reply to my earlier email.

Firstly, i can only describe my reaction as being one of complete and utter shock in response to your written statement "we belive that you have carried out fraudulent activity...".

I must offer my strongest protest at the use of such insipid, slanderous language with regards to my playing and being a customer at your casino.

I strongly urge you to offer a complete apology for this accusation, or provide full, unequivocal and incontrovertible evidence that i have been involved in criminal fraudulent activity.

May i also add that i do very much appreciate that you have these actions in place to protect your customers from fraudulent activity, but if some of your customers dont like losing, they should learn to play cards better i think !

When it comes down to it, i will not go away, i will not back down, as i feel that is what you at Ladbrokes Customer Service have been wishing for me to do over these last 3 weeks or so. In fact i highly doubt that any sort of investigation has taken place, merely a guise to confiscate an innocent customers fairly earned winnings.
3 Weeks to look into an hour or so of card playin on your tables? Exactly.

I now feel that this matter will only be fairly resolved one way, and that is in a Court of Law, proceedings for which i will be instructing my solicitor to begin at the earliest possible date.

I have also started proceedings through IBAS (Independent Betting Arbitration Services), and am in the process of contacting various sections of the media (Written Press as well as Online) to let people know just how well Ladbrokes treat their customers.
How about trying a new advertising slogan, "Come play at Ladbrokes, cos no matter what, WE always win !"

Warmest Regards

***** ******

================================================== =========

And thats where things stand as of this morning, as you can see their customer services leave alot to be desired, and if anyone was to think about playing there id heartily recommend it, thats if your not too bothered about seeing your money ever again !

[Mike Haven]

i played for about an hour and in that time i came across some very stupid players (or in my opinion one player with multiple accounts who went on tilt really bad) and i turned £100 into around £1800 ! The state of play went roughly like this, id call or raise slightly, hed come right over the top with a big raise, about half his stack usually, this happened EVERY hand, so i smelt a bluff merchant and i had pretty good cards for heads up play so i came right back at him over the top re-raising his re-raise, hence either moving him off the hand or inducing a call and beating him on the table.

Apart from something odd about these sentences, your story is very believable, imo. Although, admittedly, those sentences set the entire problem.

Do you happen to have the relevant hand histories?

Until the last few weeks, I wouldn't have listened to a story like this, but I have just been through a long saga with a certain site, myself, which I found to be an absolutely incredible demonstration of the incompetence of their Support, and hence the danger of leaving money in an unregulated offshore poker site.

At one point, after their "thorough investigations", my account and all winnings in it were frozen, and I was given
no recourse to a complaints or review procedure. They stated, more than once, that they would keep all my money
and all my winnings, period.

Wasn't I lucky, therefore, that the account that was frozen, with all of my money and winnings kept by the poker site, after their thorough investigations, was a brand new real money account at a site where I had NEVER deposited ANY money; had never received a bonus; had not played a SINGLE hand; had a nil balance; and had NO winnings in it???!!!

It was a new account that was set up honestly and correctly, backed up with copies of my Driving Licence and an Electricity Bill.

I have kept all the e-mails that went back and forth, over a period of several weeks. At an early stage Support would not respond to my e-mails, and it was only because I was thinking of taking advantage of their generous initial deposit bonus, together with my curiousity of how bad their Support could get, that I persevered. Luckily, a twoplustwo poster knew their Manager, and by writing to him I was able to reopen the e-mail correspondence. I believe if I had not had this avenue open to me I would still be on their bad risk register. The Manager did sort out the problems at their end, in the end, and, in fact, has thanked me for drawing the incident to his attention, and he will be "thoroughly investigating" the Support procedures to try to ensure that such a thing does not reoccur.

So, I wish you luck if yours is a genuine case. It won't be easy, but do keep persevering, and try to get past Support and through to the Poker Room Manager, in person.

[Synergistic Explosions]

Everyone gets ripped off by some site eventually if you play long enough. Welcome to the club.

[Audi]

Ladbrokes have WAY too much at stake to rip players off. This is either a genuine mistake on Ladbrokes part, or a case of fraudulant activity on the players part. At this point I'd plump for the former.

Perhaps a phone call to their CS staff would expedite a resolution?

[ QUOTE ]
24 hours a day Customer Service.
Please feel free to call our Customer Service team who are waiting to deal with your request on 0800 032 1133. If you are calling from outside of the UK, please call + 350 43003.

[/ QUOTE ]

[cuwdrapoes]

i see what you mean about that sentence, doesnt come across right does it!
i wish i did have the hand history mate, but the account was suspended pretty much as soon as i tried to withdraw my money (you can imagine my excitement and rush to get the money into my pocket and spent lol!), hence i was locked out of my Ladbrokes Poker Account with no access to anything, i cant even remember how much exactly was in the account at the time of it being closed.

i wouldnt mind but ive had no explanation at all for their actions. If the people (person) i played against was using stolen credit cards to fund their account then id say fair enough thats criminal and continue the investigation, BUT it seems like Ladbrokes and other major online casinos and poker rooms are using "credit card fraud" as a smokescreen for keeping customers money.

I have spoken direct to the poker manager (Ken Mackie in Gibraltar), but every time i call him now hes either out of the office or off on vacation etc etc.

I dont even know if i have recourse thru a court of law but im seeing my lawyer this week and he should give me good advice as to what i can do next.

To be honest i was really calm about this whole thing until the email late last night when i was directly accused of "fraudulent activity", and now im really f*cking riled by them !

ah well ill keep you informed of any further developments.

feels good to know im not the only member of the "ripped off by online casinos" club !

cheers

[cuwdrapoes]

hey wow thanks...never thought of ringing their general customer services number. and heres me just sitting here waiting for my money to magically fall into my lap without me doing a thing !!!

ok you can turn your sarcasm monitor off now.

[pokerjo22]

[ QUOTE ]
their Support, and hence the danger of leaving money in an unregulated offshore poker site.

[/ QUOTE ]

I believe that Ladbroke's is a UK company, and therefore far from unregulated. These sites 'might' prove helpful if you have a UK gambling complaint.

http://www.culture.gov.uk/gambling_a...ng/default.htm

http://www.ibas-uk.co.uk/

http://www.gbgb.org.uk/

[Audi]

[ QUOTE ]
hey wow thanks...never thought of ringing their general customer services number. and heres me just sitting here waiting for my money to magically fall into my lap without me doing a thing !!!

ok you can turn your sarcasm monitor off now.


[/ QUOTE ]

[img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[daveymck]

Ladbrokes are a UK company.however I am unsure how the online side is setup. It is currently illegal for a company to offer gambling in the UK on the internet (and in fact gambling is taxed at source if you use a land based bookies).

All of the major UK companies have setup offshore operations mainly in Gibralter to get round the legal and tax side, and as such I dont know if UK law could be used to pursue any claim. There is a bill passing through parliment that will change this but up till then I think you take the same risks as at Party POker etc.

Has anyone else been investigated and how long do these things normally last?

I find it very difficult to beleive that a company like ladbrokes tries to embezzle players funds, it may just be a case of being patient and letting the investigation take its course.

[utopic]

Correct me if I'm wrong but Ladbrokes is an english site.
I registered last year an account at William Hill, to bet on sport (english site too).
I then request a cashout, not winning money, just mine back, and I never got it.
As you, contacting the site was very difficult, even by phone. They finaly sent me a mail, because I needed :
_Copy of passport
_Copy of front and back of registered bank card
I send them all, talked with support at phone, but still no money
Just to say one thing, before buying in in an english site, u should check rules for cashing out, some english perhaps could give informations, but UK sites seems to need more informations to do operations, at least about cashout (apparently they dont care when you are depositing money, which can say at lot of things about...even if Ladbrokes is a well known company