Hasan Habib

[Rushmore]

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You can make this play in limit and it's not horrendous, let alone no limit. Do you guys play much high limit, shorthanded poker?

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I do, and I can tell you that I see your point of view on the second hand, if we are both assuming an aborted gameplan.

The first is really baffling, though. I'm sure you can see that.

[J_V]

I limp a lot more than most on the button in limit and no limit for various reasons. So, I don't think it's as odd or bad as some people, right or wrong.

[Gotmilk]

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I honestly believe the 10/6 hand is inexcusable.

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I disagree. For a play to be considered inexcusable it has to cost you more than 1 Big Blind in a deep stack situation. It's not impossible to win a huge pot. The big blind could have KJo and the flop could come J66... I'm not trying tro justify playing bad hands by the fact a miracle flop could come, but the point is even if its a mistake, its not a big one...and in my mind the only "inexcusable" mistakes are big ones. Everybody who watches will wonder if he has T6o from now on, and I can promise you he won't!

[Rushmore]

I respect this response. It has made me rethink my semantics, if not my entire stance on the subject.

I'll never say I like the play. But I will say that I can see that it cannot be ALL THAT WRONG.

And there's something to be said for that.

[Rushmore]

I know good and great players who limp in first on the button with a wide variety of holdings, both in limit and no limit.

In limit, I will never understand it, particularly at an aggressive table.

[Goodie]

JV, your problem here is that your trying to make this play into a world class play just because Hasan Habib is supposidly a world class player.

The problem with the play is that YES, he is trying to make a play later on in the hand. Here are the problems with this line of play:

1.) and most important is this is a nothing pot. Blind against Blind that was limped. No need to risk anything on this pot.

2.) Hasan's opponent can be fairly confident that Hasan does not have an ace and may try to re-steal regardless or may decide that a ten is good and call or re-raise.

3.) Hasan cannot be sure at all that BB does not have an ace. There was a hand in the show where he just checked in the BB in a limped pot with an ace.

Even with all of this, I don't mind too much him thinking he can make a play at the pot. It is both imaginative and aggressive. I wouldn't do it and if BB does have an ace he looks stupid, but it's not the worst play in the world.

What he did was the worst of his options. Can you tell me a worse way to play the hand? He checked called with an intention. Make your read and go with it. What was he expecting BB to do on the turn. If he checks then maybe you can take it away on the river, but maybe not. If he bets, Hasan was obviously going to fold. There are way too many things that have to go right for Hasan to win the hand.

You guys are defending Hasan for changing his read and some of you even praising him. This is insane. First of all, changing your read mid-hand is bad poker to begin with and secondly, let us not all forget, HE CHANGED HIS READ TO THE WRONG ONE. He read BB for a big hand and folded, when a raise (which was his plan) may have won him the pot.

JV, please tell me how he could have played this hand worse. please.

Peace

Goodie

[Boris]

I thought we only disagreed on whether Kobe was the second coming of Michael Jordan?

Anyways, as to the second hand I can see playing like Habib did in a limit game. I'm still waiting for an explanation for why it was such a brilliant play. I guess its because he decided to stop bluff-calling.

[TimTimSalabim]

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You guys are defending Hasan for changing his read and some of you even praising him. This is insane. First of all, changing your read mid-hand is bad poker to begin with and secondly, let us not all forget, HE CHANGED HIS READ TO THE WRONG ONE. He read BB for a big hand and folded, when a raise (which was his plan) may have won him the pot.

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Who says he changed his plan? Maybe his plan was to limp, then see what cards flopped and how his opponent reacted, then decide *afterwards* whether he could steal the pot or not. Once his opponent bet the flop, he decided he didn't have a strong enough read to risk a lot of chips going over the top. As far as limping preflop goes, a lot of the greats do it when they have lots of chips, they see a lot of flops cheaply and then they can win a lot when the opportunity arises. But if the flop comes down bad, and they don't think they can steal it, they back off so they don't go broke.

[coolhandtom]

you knew the guy was in trouble when he couldn't stop moving his legs, and started sweating profusely.. large tells of nervousness and weak hands. [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]