Sklansky's suited group 3 and 4 hands

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Suited group 3 hands are: J-10s, K-Js, A-10s, Q-Js
Suited group 4 hands are: J-9s, Q-10s, K-10s, 9-8s

Should you call with these hands when there is a raise and you expect there to be 4 or less opponents?

What if it is raised and re-raised (so 3 to call) but you expect a nice multi-way pot. Is it a good idea to call or cap in this situation?
Let me give an example from my 10-20 game tonight which got me thinking about all this. I was sitting with Q-10s in MP+2. 1 EP limper. EP+2 raises. MP re-raises (legitimate raiser). I fold. 5 ended up seeing a flop of Q-10-7 (rainbow). My hand would have been good. I would have called the 2 bet, but folded for the 3 bet pre-flop.

Any help or thoughts appreciated.

[Spyder]

I don't think you can call two bets with group 4 hands.

I wouldn't (usually) call three bets with group 3 hands.

I await the experts' opinions [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Spyder

[DMBFan23]

I am a newb, so I am prepared to be flamed. but I would never cold call three with any of the group 4 hands, and probably not any of the group three hands (but maybe in LP in a multiway pot), if the raisers are truly legitimate raisers

[nykenny]

[ QUOTE ]
Suited group 3 hands are: J-10s, K-Js, A-10s, Q-Js
Suited group 4 hands are: J-9s, Q-10s, K-10s, 9-8s


[/ QUOTE ]

typically, you should fold all of the above mentioned hands facing a raise, UNLESS there are already (or VERY LIKELY) 4 or more players in the pot and it's unlikely the pot get raised again, when holding suited connectors. for the gappers (1 or 2 gapper), i would be more inclined to fold unless there are MANY opponents and you are almost closing the action.

as for no raise, many of these hands can be played if the pot is already opened.

when you are first-in, you should will only open (raise) the pot with these hands towards Mid-Late-Positions. to open the pot, you will want to do it with the higher end of this spectrum, ie. ATs, KJs... a case can be made to open limp with JTs, T9s or ATs up front, but the game condition has to be right.

but anyway, you should ALWAYS keep in mind that the starting hand strategy is meant to be merely a guideline. you will need to develop your own feel of the games and people you play with, thus adjusting constantly as things change.

Kenny

[Kenshin]

In a tough game, you should open raise in EP with 10JS and the like occasionally. HEFAP explains the logic behind this play.

kenshin

[Michael Davis]

I almost never call any of those hands for a raise. I wouldn't play for three bets cold.

-Michael

[balkii]

You need to change your results-oriented thinking. So the flop came down and you would have had top two pair and would have won the pot, big deal. What cards did the raisers hold? AA? KK? AQ? JJ? TT? you do not want to play QT against any legitmate 3-betting hand because it is already crushed and you will be chasing.

Never call 3 cold with any of those hands

The times to coldcall 2 with these hands will be few and far between, and until you can recognize when the proper time to play would be you are better off just folding.

[elitegimp]

[ QUOTE ]
You need to change your results-oriented thinking. So the flop came down and you would have had top two pair and would have won the pot, big deal. What cards did the raisers hold? AA? KK? AQ? JJ? TT? you do not want to play QT against any legitmate 3-betting hand because it is already crushed and you will be chasing.


[/ QUOTE ]

quoted and emphasized because I agree (be glad I don't know the UBB code to make text bigger [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] )