The Nuts Out Of Position - Seeking Advice

[PDosterM]

10-20 holdem in a locals club. I’m in the big blind with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. Two early players limp and a very strong, tight-aggressive middle player raises. It’s folded to me. I call as do the two limpers. Four see the flop with $82 in the pot. The flop is K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

Since I am so likely to win, my main concern is getting as much in the pot as possible, but I’m out of position. Not only is the King likely to have helped the raiser, the raiser will almost surely bet if checked to. I check, and so do the limpers. The pre-flop raiser bets. I call to entice the limpers in. One folds, one calls. The turn is 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].

Here is where I need help. What thought process should I now go through to decide among betting out, check-calling, or check-raising? I have a reasonably tight image.

Thanks in advance.

[stoxtrader]

If the Pre-Flop raiser is first to act behind me, A check raise would be the better play, but in this instance I would check call the flop and bet out on the turn as you did.

While it is likely you will see a few folds, and doubt your play, I think you have to give someone the chance to make the mistake of raising or three-betting with a set or non-nut flush, and the best spot for that mistake to be made is on the turn.

[James Boston]

[ QUOTE ]
While it is likely you will see a few folds, and doubt your play, I think you have to give someone the chance to make the mistake of raising or three-betting with a set or non-nut flush,

[/ QUOTE ]

I think if he comes out betting, he loses the limper. Then, the pre-flop raiser will have to throw in a few extra bets to compensate, and there's no guarantee he'll do that. If he still feels confident that he will be bet into, he can check-call the turn, and wait until the river for the check-raise.

[andyfox]

I'd hate to see the turn checked through. Your call on the flop may scare the pre-flop raiser, especially with the ace of trumps in your hand. With the limper in between, I'd bet the turn.

[Garland]

Since you're so unconcerned about giving a free card, and the 3 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] is not likely to change the situation, I would check again. The leader is unlikely to check it through because he can't tell whether callers have a flush or if guys are on a flush draw.

If there's a bet, now's the time to go for a checkraise declaring your strength. You'll often get paid to the river with one pair in these games ($10-$20 relatively low stakes).

If it's checked through on the turn, it's unlikely anyone had a really strong hand such as a K or AA. The preflop raiser may have an underpair to the KK and is looking for a cheap showdown. But if this were true, you leading out would often times cause them to fold anyways. No problems as you should lead the river and you'll usually get a "curiosity call" somewhere.

Garland

[Nightwish]

You said that you think the K is likely to have helped the raiser. This is precisely why you need to bet the flop. Not only that, but he might also think that you're betting with as little as just an Ac. Anyway, bet the flop, you'll hopefully get at least one of the limpers to call and MP will raise. If so, just call and bet out again on the turn. If you're raised again, you should now 3-bet.

[amerksmann22]

My Line would be to bet out on all streets.
If raised on flop call and then bet out turn.
If raised on the turn then you can re-raise.
With the player most like to bet as the last to act you cant check raise without losing someone. In order to allow a draw and get a raise in, you need to bet and hope for a re-raise if not you still will get your bets on all streets w/o any check-throughs by leading on each street.

[Philuva]

I think the best way to get the most money in the pot with the pre-flop raiser now acting as the button is to bet the flop. If it gets checked to the button and he bets, and you call, the two limpers in between will only call with a K or a high club usually. Which is the same situation if you bet out. The bonus of betting out on the flop, is the button will raise some of the time after the limpers have called or folded.

Given the way you played it, I would bet out on the turn and again hope the button will raise, which is less likely on the expensive streets compared to the flop, which is why I like betting out on the flop better.