Two books to Omaha success?

[Taxman]

I am a long time hold 'em player looking to get in to Omaha Hi-Lo (and some Omaha high) and as far as I can tell Ciaffone and Zee have the best books on the subject so my question is can I become an "expert" or at least a very strong amateur just by close study of these two books and some play time? Or does anyone have another suggestion for a source of info?

[Buzz]

Taxman - I think you may be making a mistake by lumping Omaha-8 and Omaha-hi together in terms of playing strategy. My experience is they are quite different, just as seven card stud and seven-card-stud-high-low-eight-or-better are quite different in terms of playing strategy.

On the basis of my experience, I believe there is more similarity between the two common high-low split games with an eight qualifier for low than between one form of Omaha and the other. That is not (at all) to suggest Omaha-8 and seven-stud-8 are very similar.

To someone who doesn’t know much about the various games, all forms of poker may seem similar - and, in some ways they are. General principles of poker certainly apply. But as one gets more involved in surviving playing in the various games offered in casinos, nuances emerge which take on more significance as one becomes more aware. Of course you’ll often run across individuals who play Omaha-8 as though they were playing Texas hold ‘em - and some of these individuals have such good poker sense that they make it work for them - or at least that’s how it sometimes seems. More often, the more aggressive style needed for success at Texas hold ‘em comes up short for Omaha-8.

My suggestion to you is to begin with one game or the other, but not both at once.

Except for a couple of new books I haven’t run across yet (both just out this year-end) I have studied every book related to Omaha or Omaha-8 I’ve encountered - about a dozen or so of them.

I can’t advise you as to what book(s) to get for Omaha-high.

If you want to play Omaha-8, Ray Zee’s book has seemed the best to me.

Just my opinion.

Buzz

[Taxman]

Thanks for the input Buzz. To clarify, I am much more interested in O8 and I have a general idea of strategy as far as generally playing tight, jamming early with a ton of outs, and going for nut hands (in low limit games of course). I included Omaha high as a possibility mostly because I know it's a big part of Ciaffone's book. Your point is well taken however and I think I will focus on O8 mastery (at least to my satisfaction) before I pursue something else. Mostly what I'm curious about is if anyone thinks a dedicated study and application of say Ray Zee's book alone would be sufficient to beat many mid/high limit games as opposed to the extremely weak low limit games which even I seem able to easily beat with little experience. Also does the relatively limited amout of O8 info in Ciaffone's book make it unecessary for the aspiring O8 player? Any other good sources or thoughts would be great as well. Is O8 worth pursuing at a higher level? Thanks again for the advice.

[Buzz]

"Mostly what I'm curious about is if anyone thinks a dedicated study and application of say Ray Zee's book alone would be sufficient to beat many mid/high limit games as opposed to the extremely weak low limit games which even I seem able to easily beat with little experience. Also does the relatively limited amout of O8 info in Ciaffone's book make it unecessary for the aspiring O8 player?"

Taxman - It isn't necessary to read a book about Omaha-8 to enjoy the game. Nor is it necessary to read a book about Omaha-8 to win.

But although not "necessary," studying the game of poker in general and Omaha-8 in particular seems sensible if you're planning to play much Omaha-8. I think you'll cut your losses and increase your gains if you study the game first. However, how to best study depends on your motivation and learning level. Since you asked about books, I suggested the one I thought best, the one by Ray Zee.

But I can't say how successful you'll be whether or not you read about the game.

Regarding the Ciaffone book, do you mean the one titled "Omaha Holdem Poker"? If so, for me, the book was (and is) worth the twenty bucks I paid for it. However, I can't say if it would be worth twenty bucks to you or not. Bear in mind that when playing poker in a casino, twenty bucks doesn't seem like much to me.

Buzz

[chaos]

I think Ray zee's book is the best book out there. I too have read every Omaha/8 title I've come across.

Ray Zee's book like some other 2+2 titles; it will take some work to get the most out of it. I know some players who found it too difficult. Shane Smith does a good job of laying out the basics. Bill Boston's book of the results of his simulations of every possible starting hand provides some food for thought. The O/8 section in Caro and Cappelltti's Poker at the Millenium is a waste of time.

I can't report on the new O/8 books recently published yet. The Lou Kreiger book is the mail to me. When I finish it I'll pick up the new Cappelletti book (hoping he decided to put useful the useful Omaha/8 material there since it sure isn't in Poker at the Millenium).

[Al Mirpuri]

It is not possible to have access to too many resources.

You should read the dross just to see and understand what mistakes are being made by other Omaha/Omaha8 players.

Large amounts of time spent thinking about the game in general and your game in particular (the one you play in or will play in) will also aid you.

Zee's book is a must for Omaha8.

Ciaffone's book is a must for Omaha High.

[Taxman]

I suppose it's true that as long as you can distinguish the good advice from the bad, both are worth study. Thanks guys.

[dogsballs]

Zee and Ciaffone both great and well worth it.
If you fancy joining in hte soft online PLO games, get the Ciaffone/Reuben PL and NL Poker (big bet advice, PLO section) as well as Improve your Poker by Ciaffone (good all round poker advice plus more PLO stuff).

I agree strongly with Buzz - O8 and O Hi both very different games.

[ChipWrecked]

Online resources I'm using while learning O8:


Steve Badger's website
Annie Duke's articles at UB
Ciaffone's archives at Cardplayer.com
'Other' archives here at 2+2 (including much good stuff posted by Buzz)


Haven't read any books yet, but these plus a solid underpinning in TOP have me doing pretty well.

Good luck
-Chip